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The Unknown Avenger




If Ronin is Hawkeye I can't see him being anti-registration. Hawkeye was killed by one of his friends...the Scarlet Witch. A super powerful mutant. She also killed Scott Lang. I just think Clint would become an uber SHIELD agent before a renegade Avenger. (Renegade Avengers coming this fall! it sounds like a good title)


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GammaSpidey




All they had to tell Clint was that the "New" Avengers were Cap's team. Clint idolizes the guy and wishes to honor his memory. Mr. Barton's also never hesitated to give the finger to the establishment either.


> If Ronin is Hawkeye I can't see him being anti-registration. Hawkeye was killed by one of his friends...the Scarlet Witch. A super powerful mutant. She also killed Scott Lang. I just think Clint would become an uber SHIELD agent before a renegade Avenger. (Renegade Avengers coming this fall! it sounds like a good title)


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Bildo




Although I think he would be a perfect fit in the Mighty Avengers as Hawkeye!!!!


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Vision Williams




> Although I think he would be a perfect fit in the Mighty Avengers as Hawkeye!!!!


Clint has always been a rebel of sort, at odds with Iron Man (WCA, e.g.) and the antithesis of a corporate/government trooper. In terms of New Avengers, a few years ago I would have scoffed at the lineup but their thematic reasons to be are so strong/Avenger related that the team is irresistible to me and my top pull each month lately. All that being said I am glad Bendis added one man who has been an Avenger long before Bendis took over the book.

zeeeeeee-chief


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CaptKlondike




.. I mean the "crossing" attempted frame job, Iron Man not being there when Mockingbird died, The cloing down the WCA/ForceWorks mess, even back in Kurt and George's first arc,, Vol #3 when Clint told Cap he knew it'd be a mistake to go to to Iron Man.He wouldn't need to be pro-Cap (although he definetly was) but VERY anti-Tony Stark.


> All they had to tell Clint was that the "New" Avengers were Cap's team. Clint idolizes the guy and wishes to honor his memory. Mr. Barton's also never hesitated to give the finger to the establishment either.
>
>
> > If Ronin is Hawkeye I can't see him being anti-registration. Hawkeye was killed by one of his friends...the Scarlet Witch. A super powerful mutant. She also killed Scott Lang. I just think Clint would become an uber SHIELD agent before a renegade Avenger. (Renegade Avengers coming this fall! it sounds like a good title)


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XPac




> If Ronin is Hawkeye I can't see him being anti-registration. Hawkeye was killed by one of his friends...the Scarlet Witch. A super powerful mutant. She also killed Scott Lang. I just think Clint would become an uber SHIELD agent before a renegade Avenger. (Renegade Avengers coming this fall! it sounds like a good title)

The last thing Clint would ever support is the government or the public telling him or any other Avenger how to do their jobs.

He'd likely take the same stance Cap would for he same reason. Heck, I think he wanted the New Avengers to be MORE rebellious than they were acting at the moment. They're coming off rather conservative (not in a political way) by his tastes... if Clint were in charge, they'd probably be storming Stark Tower as we speak.


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The Unknown Avenger




I guess this was more about Cap vs. Iron Man. And I didn't even realize some of the reasons Clint hated Tony.

Was Cap at Bobbi's funeral? Stark did always bankroll Clint though. ;\)


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Brand Echh




Clint just ain't the type to stay underground and stealthy for long. Sure that's how he started and he's gone underground and incognito several times over his career... but he could never stay that way. He loves the limelight too much.

And as cynical as he acts, he's an optimist at heart. He believes the best in people even when he says otherwise and even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Now, that doesn't mean for a second he would turn on his friends, so he'd never really side with Tony should it come to blows, and I don't see Tony asking him to join the Mighty Avengers for just that reason.

On the other hand, he would jump at the chance to train the next generation, and that's just what I see him doing. He'd be perfect for the Initiative.




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spiderprince




> Clint just ain't the type to stay underground and stealthy for long. Sure that's how he started and he's gone underground and incognito several times over his career... but he could never stay that way. He loves the limelight too much.

Clint is far from a glory hound. He left the Avengers to help the Thunderbolts. If that doesn't say that the guy doesn't care what other people think I don't know what does.

> And as cynical as he acts, he's an optimist at heart. He believes the best in people even when he says otherwise and even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Not sure what this has to with joining the Initiative.

> Now, that doesn't mean for a second he would turn on his friends, so he'd never really side with Tony should it come to blows, and I don't see Tony asking him to join the Mighty Avengers for just that reason.

He wouldn't join the MA and your right that Tony wouldn't even ask him.

> On the other hand, he would jump at the chance to train the next generation, and that's just what I see him doing. He'd be perfect for the Initiative.

Normally I would agree, but I can't see him siding with the system just to get to help the kids. For the reasons you listed and keeping with Clints personality I always thought that he would be the perfect mentor for the Young Avengers (or at least the ones who aren't with the Initiative like Patriot or Hawkeye). He'd still be helping the younger generation but they at least have the choice to do what they do.


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BlakGard




> Clint just ain't the type to stay underground and stealthy for long.
> Sure that's how he started and he's gone underground and incognito
> several times over his career... but he could never stay that way. He
> loves the limelight too much.

Limelight can be achieved while underground and incognito.

> And as cynical as he acts, he's an optimist at heart. He believes the
> best in people even when he says otherwise and even in the face of
> overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

His cynical nature is what would keep him Anti-Reg. His optimistism is what keeps him a hero. And by his very words, going way back, he believes that the best in people comes from independence from government controls.

> Now, that doesn't mean for a second he would turn on his friends, so
> he'd never really side with Tony should it come to blows, and I don't
> see Tony asking him to join the Mighty Avengers for just that reason.
>
> On the other hand, he would jump at the chance to train the next
> generation, and that's just what I see him doing. He'd be perfect for
> the Initiative.

Unfortunately, you can be both Initiative and Anti-Reg. Plus, if he did decide to try the Initiative way, it wouldn't work out for long, because he's too rebellious and his views are diametrically opposed to everyone in control of the Initiative. He wouldn't stand for a single thing any of them are doing for a split second.
____________________



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Sandman




> > Clint just ain't the type to stay underground and stealthy for long.
> > Sure that's how he started and he's gone underground and incognito
> > several times over his career... but he could never stay that way. He
> > loves the limelight too much.
>
> Limelight can be achieved while underground and incognito.
>
> > And as cynical as he acts, he's an optimist at heart. He believes the
> > best in people even when he says otherwise and even in the face of
> > overwhelming evidence to the contrary.
>
> His cynical nature is what would keep him Anti-Reg. His optimistism is what keeps him a hero. And by his very words, going way back, he believes that the best in people comes from independence from government controls.
>
> > Now, that doesn't mean for a second he would turn on his friends, so
> > he'd never really side with Tony should it come to blows, and I don't
> > see Tony asking him to join the Mighty Avengers for just that reason.
> >
> > On the other hand, he would jump at the chance to train the next
> > generation, and that's just what I see him doing. He'd be perfect for
> > the Initiative.
>
> Unfortunately, you can be both Initiative and Anti-Reg. Plus, if he did decide to try the Initiative way, it wouldn't work out for long, because he's too rebellious and his views are diametrically opposed to everyone in control of the Initiative. He wouldn't stand for a single thing any of them are doing for a split second.

He be the one with the kids' best interest in mind and be on Cloud 9's side who joined to get a license to use her powers and start punching people like Gauntlet and Gyrich, as well as Tony and Pym, for being irresponsible hypocrites who send untrained and underaged kids to a battle as if they were weapons to be used. He would never agreed to such insanity and when he trained the Great Lake Avengers, he made sure there were fail-safes in the training and make sure they were ready like a professional.
> ____________________
>


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Brand Echh





> Clint is far from a glory hound. He left the Avengers to help the Thunderbolts. If that doesn't say that the guy doesn't care what other people think I don't know what does.

Right, but how long did that last? His own stated goal was to show the world (and more specifically the Avengers) that these guys could reform. He wanted to do this publically, not just for his own piece of mind. However he excuses it, it was still about attention. It was for the right reasons, sure, but it still was about attention.

Cable is the opposite of that. He took on the New Mutants, not to prove in public that these kids could be heroes, but because he knew they could be heroes. He did everything he could to keep them out of the public eye - which probably would have been a good idea for the Thunderbolts.

> > And as cynical as he acts, he's an optimist at heart. He believes the best in people even when he says otherwise and even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

> Not sure what this has to with joining the Initiative.

In other words, even if he acts like a rebel, he usually sticks with traditional super-heroic values.

> Normally I would agree, but I can't see him siding with the system just to get to help the kids. For the reasons you listed and keeping with Clints personality I always thought that he would be the perfect mentor for the Young Avengers (or at least the ones who aren't with the Initiative like Patriot or Hawkeye). He'd still be helping the younger generation but they at least have the choice to do what they do.

I maintain that this is exactly what he would do, and he would do it for the kids.

Don't misunderstandme. I'm not suggesting Hawkeye is a gloryhound out to get attention for himself, what I'm saying is, he has a good heart and wants to get the right things done - he just wants to do them in as public a way as possible.



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Redhulk





> He be the one with the kids' best interest in mind and be on Cloud 9's side who joined to get a license to use her powers and start punching people like Gauntlet and Gyrich, as well as Tony and Pym, for being irresponsible hypocrites who send untrained and underaged kids to a battle as if they were weapons to be used. He would never agreed to such insanity and when he trained the Great Lake Avengers, he made sure there were fail-safes in the training and make sure they were ready like a professional.

I think he would only do that if it was training as an INDEPENDENT school outside of the governements control like Xaviers or a new (new) Avengers.

No way on earth Clint would even bother toeing the line for the government and protecting the kids through training just so they could be mindbleached soldiers put into conflict situations for political ends.

Clint might be for training but he is not for producing soldiers out of kids who don't want to kill people nor beleive in in the political idealogy of the govenrment just as the Government would want a secular government free from religion, Hawkeye would want a secular Avengers free from politics.

the USA is not the avengers as soon you start thinking it is you have problems the initivive is a USA centric world police.

the Avengers just happened to be a cosmic/godly/alien beings BASED in the USA...
the inherient problem of the Initive is if the USA suddenly voted in a facist governemnt, a communist government or some other kind of government that was democratically elected but had overly right wing or left wing ideas they instantly get a superhero police state to enforce their agenda.


Inititive is NOT just about training the kids its about USING them for the agendas that the governemnt see fit. Maybe we would see them being put to work to stop a strike in a steel making factory, or in a premeptive attack on a soverign nation, or even a revenge attack on a nation that has commited terrorism on it (a bit like Hulks reason to invade the US)

The inititive is only good as long as the US government in marvel comics is righteous and pure.

So knowing Hawkeye, No he would not HELP train little murderers.

And apologies to all Soldiers out there but they are not paid to think, if told to shoot to kill they must do it, now imagine if a young peter parker was told to do that? He would be a pacifist and labelled a coward, he would try a non lethal way, he would FAIL the initiave as such, he couldn't do what cloud 9 did.

In fact most superheros would make awful soldiers as push comes to shove they would NOT resort to lethal force to protect the nation.




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