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Jonathan




Pardon me for asking while Batman is in the middle of something, but he's always in the middle of something.

I'm reading Under the Hood.

Does this take place AFTER Hush or what?

In this story arc, Oracle is dead? When did this happen and when did she come back to life, if she did? Keep in mind that I am reading vol 1 of Under the Hood, that I have not finished vol 1, that I read very slowly (just call it age plus bad genetics)and that I have read very little of Batman relative to what there is and I have forgotten much of such story arcs as Long Halloween.

Batman has never been a favorite of mine because I was introduced by the 60s tv show. I don't think that show was ever intended for anyone who wanted to take "serious" comic books seriously and then laugh at Archie.

The "death" (oh, PLEASE!)of Captain America has forced me to look at other things for a while. Naturally it's not the same. Comparisons between the two are stupid. They aren't the same kind of hero, they don't live the same way, they don't work the same way. Captain America is more like Deathstroke in terms of ability than he is like Batman. There is no one like Batman. There is no one like Captain America.

Anyway, I'm just trying to get the time line right, more or less. And Under the Hood all takes place before Etrigan (or whatever) #1?


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Thatguy




> Pardon me for asking while Batman is in the middle of something, but he's always in the middle of something.
>
> I'm reading Under the Hood.
>
> Does this take place AFTER Hush or what?
>
> In this story arc, Oracle is dead? When did this happen and when did she come back to life, if she did? Keep in mind that I am reading vol 1 of Under the Hood, that I have not finished vol 1, that I read very slowly (just call it age plus bad genetics)and that I have read very little of Batman relative to what there is and I have forgotten much of such story arcs as Long Halloween.

Err, what makes you think that? Oracle never died (though she had some close calls).


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Icon




> Pardon me for asking while Batman is in the middle of something, but he's always in the middle of something.
>
> I'm reading Under the Hood.
>
> Does this take place AFTER Hush or what?
>
> In this story arc, Oracle is dead?

Oracle is not dead and never has been. However, _Orpheus_ was an aspiring hero who was killed in the "War Games" storyline by Black Mask, who then, in one of many "WTF?" moments in the story, managed to impersonate him so perfectly after only meeting him for a minute or so, that it fooled even Batman.


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Jonathan




I may well be confused, but it's not about Orpheus and Black Mask. I have not heard of Orpheus apart from the Greek (then Roman) myth.

I won't insist that Oracle is dead.

The page after Black Mask asks Mr Freeze to kill Red Hood, Nightwing and Batman talk about not being able to use Oracle any more. There are a couple of pictures that look like someone or something being blown to pieces with two tires in the middle of the pic. They don't say Barbara Gordon is dead. That's why I ended the phrase with a question mark, as you see below. What they mean about not being able to rely on Oracle any more and all that is more than I know, but it sounded to me like death, so I asked.

I know nothing. I thought I'd read somewhere that Barbara had somehow recovered sensation in her legs and was trying to get back into costume. I would not put any money on THAT, either.

I have not read anything with the Black mask obviously in it, so I can't be mixed up about which Black Mask story it is.

Anyway, I think my original question (in whatever order it ended up) was whether Under the Hood was before or after Hush.

I also wondered about where it said that this story occurred before Blood of the Demon #1. Etrigan and whatsisname had already been around for ages, so that must have just been one story arc among many, right?


If I knew this stuff, I would not be asking.;)

I don't have enough information to be confused, only puzzled.



> > Pardon me for asking while Batman is in the middle of something, but he's always in the middle of something.
> >
> > I'm reading Under the Hood.
> >
> > Does this take place AFTER Hush or what?
> >
> > In this story arc, Oracle is dead?
>
> Oracle is not dead and never has been. However, _Orpheus_ was an aspiring hero who was killed in the "War Games" storyline by Black Mask, who then, in one of many "WTF?" moments in the story, managed to impersonate him so perfectly after only meeting him for a minute or so, that it fooled even Batman.


Posted with Mozilla Firefox 2.0.0.7 on Windows XP
Icon




> I may well be confused, but it's not about Orpheus and Black Mask. I have not heard of Orpheus apart from the Greek (then Roman) myth.
>
> I won't insist that Oracle is dead.

Good, because there's about three or four years worth of comics just aching to prove you wrong! \:\)

> The page after Black Mask asks Mr Freeze to kill Red Hood, Nightwing and Batman talk about not being able to use Oracle any more. There are a couple of pictures that look like someone or something being blown to pieces with two tires in the middle of the pic. They don't say Barbara Gordon is dead. That's why I ended the phrase with a question mark, as you see below. What they mean about not being able to rely on Oracle any more and all that is more than I know, but it sounded to me like death, so I asked.

At the end of War Games, because of the way Batman let events escalate, Oracle's computers were compromised and her Clocktower attacked by Black Mask.

In order to stop Batman killing Black Mask, Barbara had to self destruct her Clocktower to force Batman to save her life rather than pursue Black Mask. It destroyed her equipment, but more than that it destroyed all her personal items, her family photos, mememtos, souvenirs of her life as Barbara Gordon, Batgirl and Oracle.

She was out of action for some time as Oracle, and was understandably furious with Batman so cut her ties to him (This was all part of War Games purpose to make Batman a loner again; Spoiler and Orpheus are dead, Batgirl and Robin relocates to Bludhaven after Spoiler and Tim's father are killed, and Nightwing is emo-ing all over the place before going into his insane "Let's infiltrate the mafia using my real name" period.

> I know nothing. I thought I'd read somewhere that Barbara had somehow recovered sensation in her legs and was trying to get back into costume. I would not put any money on THAT, either.

Try this for some more info

> I have not read anything with the Black mask obviously in it, so I can't be mixed up about which Black Mask story it is.
>
> Anyway, I think my original question (in whatever order it ended up) was whether Under the Hood was before or after Hush.

Way after. "Hush" was never supposed to have featured the real Jason Todd. That was a retcon a couple of years later. The "Jason" seen in Hush was intended to be Clayface mimicking Nightwing's skills and a modified appearance. It was a good while later they came up with the "terrific" idea to resurrect Jason and retcon him into the Hush story.



Posted with Mozilla Firefox 2.0.0.7 on Windows XP
Jonathan





> > I know nothing. I thought I'd read somewhere that Barbara had somehow recovered sensation in her legs and was trying to get back into costume. I would not put any money on THAT, either.
>
> Try this for some more info

Try what?

>
> > I have not read anything with the Black mask obviously in it, so I can't be mixed up about which Black Mask story it is.
> >
> > Anyway, I think my original question (in whatever order it ended up) was whether Under the Hood was before or after Hush.
>
> Way after. "Hush" was never supposed to have featured the real Jason Todd. That was a retcon a couple of years later. The "Jason" seen in Hush was intended to be Clayface mimicking Nightwing's skills and a modified appearance. It was a good while later they came up with the "terrific" idea to resurrect Jason and retcon him into the Hush story.
>

Thanks!


Posted with Mozilla Firefox 2.0.0.7 on Windows XP
Jonathan





> > In this story arc, Oracle is dead? When did this happen and when did she come back to life, if she did? Keep in mind that I am reading vol 1 of Under the Hood, that I have not finished vol 1, that I read very slowly (just call it age plus bad genetics)and that I have read very little of Batman relative to what there is and I have forgotten much of such story arcs as Long Halloween.
>
> Err, what makes you think that? Oracle never died (though she had some close calls).

What made me ask that (I didn't think it, I asked it)were the pages I described.


Posted with Mozilla Firefox 2.0.0.7 on Windows XP

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