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Unthinking


Member Since: Mon Jul 16, 2018
Posts: 1,447


... who and why?


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BlackGhost


Member Since: Sun Feb 11, 2018


Odin Force is strong but it is not that much when compared to the universe altering, space-time messing powers of The Phoenix. Plus the Odin Force has to be recharged and not a good enough tool for a long or an on par battle, unlike the Phoenix Force which could go on and on…. It is the sum of all life in the Universe, after all.


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Unthinking


Member Since: Mon Jul 16, 2018
Posts: 1,447



    Quote:
    Odin Force is strong but it is not that much when compared to the universe altering, space-time messing powers of The Phoenix.


Not what we saw recently. An Odin Powered Thor beat Galactus far easier than the Phoenix ever did.

Also, Odin put the God Storm inside Mjolnir as an attack against the Phoenix... an attack that proved effective.



    Quote:
    Plus the Odin Force has to be recharged and not a good enough tool for a long or an on par battle, unlike the Phoenix Force which could go on and on…. It is the sum of all life in the Universe, after all.


You have a point on stamina, BUT this part of the Phoenix Force is just a hyperbole. Galactus and the Phoenix are portrayed as peers, even when he's not fully fed.



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bd2999

Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008


At current it would be a toss up. Classically the PF itself was much more powerful.

Even with Rachel as the host it was able to match and outlast Galactus. So, generally I would favor the PF.




Look Raist bunnies...
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BlackGhost


Member Since: Sun Feb 11, 2018


The Phoenix Force, Rachel Summers fought Galactus with a part of the Phoenix Force power, Galactus and the Celestials are relatively the same power level and Odin couldn't effect the Celestials with the Destroyer armor. The Phoenix Force is in fact the embodiment of all lives in the Multiverse, so only Jean Grey in the White Hot Room as the Phoenix of the White Crown has ever been observed with it's full potential, even Rachel vs Galactus was only a small sample of it's true power. So while the Odinforce is powerful the Phoenix Force is multiverse and fundamental, it is just hampered by the host and the tie to the M'Krann Crystal, it is a Nexus of the Multiverse so the closer the Phoenix host is the more Multiverse level they become.


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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



    Quote:

      Quote:
      Odin Force is strong but it is not that much when compared to the universe altering, space-time messing powers of The Phoenix.



    Quote:
    Not what we saw recently. An Odin Powered Thor beat Galactus far easier than the Phoenix ever did.



    Quote:
    Also, Odin put the God Storm inside Mjolnir as an attack against the Phoenix... an attack that proved effective.



    Quote:


      Quote:
      Plus the Odin Force has to be recharged and not a good enough tool for a long or an on par battle, unlike the Phoenix Force which could go on and on…. It is the sum of all life in the Universe, after all.



    Quote:
    You have a point on stamina, BUT this part of the Phoenix Force is just a hyperbole. Galactus and the Phoenix are portrayed as peers, even when he's not fully fed.


You act as though continuity has any semblance of consistency in Marvel today.
Continuity in Marvel is currently so broken that conversations like this are for the first time genuinely irrelevant.
Marvel canon is currently without editorial oversight and thus at the complete mercy of the writer's whim.

Galactus can very believably one-shot the Phoenix (he did to Dormammu after all) then turn around and lose Herald King Thor who then struggles with the Hulk.

I miss the good old days when versus discussions could be rationalized and some semblance of consistency observed.






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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020



    Quote:
    The Phoenix Force, Rachel Summers fought Galactus with a part of the Phoenix Force power, Galactus and the Celestials are relatively the same power level and Odin couldn't effect the Celestials with the Destroyer armor. The Phoenix Force is in fact the embodiment of all lives in the Multiverse, so only Jean Grey in the White Hot Room as the Phoenix of the White Crown has ever been observed with it's full potential, even Rachel vs Galactus was only a small sample of it's true power. So while the Odinforce is powerful the Phoenix Force is multiverse and fundamental, it is just hampered by the host and the tie to the M'Krann Crystal, it is a Nexus of the Multiverse so the closer the Phoenix host is the more Multiverse level they become.


Are you sure about that? Really

I mean for 40 years we knew Galactus was the product of the union between Galan and the Sentience of the previous universe. Confirmed over and over again by various writers, omniscient narrators, in-universe by beings with cosmic awareness - and also confirmed to be a necessary agent of balance in the current MU.

But now the Big G is apparently a runaway herald of a universe-eating ink blob called Black Winter. .
Galactus is just a 20 billion year cosmic man-on-the-run these days who has his power easily stolen by Thor.

Nothing previously established holds any weight these days, Marvel editorial really needs to tighten up.





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Volstagg jr


Member Since: Wed Feb 12, 2020


Under Aaron and Cates, current Odin is a sap. The latest issue of Thor saw Thor and Odin struggling against some giant fur babies or something. Freya with a big ass machine gun saved them 'cause yeah that makes sense. I'm going with The Phoenix Force for the reasons I just stated.


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BlackGhost


Member Since: Sun Feb 11, 2018


I agree 100% that Marvel editorial really needs to tighten up...

There are several factors leading to the problems in Marvel Comics.

First, the quality of writing and artwork dramatically declined. Some of that has to do with editorial control and some of it has to do with Marvel hiring writers and editors with little or no experience in Marvel Comics. Many, in fact, appear to have little or no knowledge of the characters in question. So, you have stories which ignore prior continuity or haphazardly retcon prior history. Or, worse, repeat prior history.

For example, in Iron Man, they completely changed the main character, Tony Stark, to be an adopted son of Howard and Maria Stark for no real good reason. They introduced a new character, his “real mom” who is a completely useless character.

Second, Marvel is revamped many mainstream the characters to appeal to diversity, even if the new characters make little or no sense.

Again, with Iron Man (my favorite character) was replaced with a teenage black girl named Riri Williams. Keep in mind that Tony Stark went to war with the US government to keep his technology secret (look up Armor Wars). Yet, now, we are supposed to believe that he’d just turn over his tech to a teenage girl who he barely knows?

Third, the constant annual super events which requires readers to buy an enormous number of comics to keep up with the event. And, each event almost seems to have no impact on the Marvel Universe. The comics seem to lurch from crisis to crisis without any time to develop characters or have interesting stories play out.

Fourth, and related, the constant special covers and editions that no one wants.

Fifth, the constant reboots of characters that have failed. Captain Marvel doesn’t sell, so they’ll just reboot it. Or America Chavez fails so they release a new series. If the fans don’t want to buy the comic, stop making it.

Sixth, Marvel writers and editors expressing disdain or, even hatred, towards fans. I have literally been told that I’m a racist because I said that I’m skeptical of the Riri Williams character. The current writer of Iron Man, Dan Slott, has blocked me on Twitter and I have no idea why, but presumably because I follow Richard Meyer on Twitter.

TL;DR Marvel isn’t giving the fans what they want and expresses disdain for the fans to express their displeasure.


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Immodicus


Member Since: Wed Jun 24, 2020




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JesusFan


Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008


Marvel has just decided to trash the prior continuity, and go big time for wokness, Diversity, and gas power!


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