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CABLE100




Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.


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Blargh




> Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.



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stupid baby




> Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.


well, thats my opinion,
I know I will buy a lot more marvel books once he is not editor in cheif
( did he have mephistos hep to get that? )
I was once a die hard Marvel Zombie. now I only get X Factor.
besides all of that stuff you mentioned will prolly be reversed soon, Iron man's crimes will be swept under the rug, retconned, and never mentioned again, and Spiderman's one of the worst comics ideas, his deal with the devil, will be retconned and ignored as well.
so just be patient.


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Blackagar Boltagon

Has A sore Foot




I mean that too.



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autochron




And I can back that up with examples and well-formulated arguments. My main point would be the loss of artistic integrity and morality, as well as loss of overall scope of vision and continuity that embodies Marvel's essence these days BUT...

One caveat will always undermine my arguments: Marvel is making more money these days than they have in years. Maybe chalk that up to whatever's going on in society these days but kiddies are lapping this stuff up! You cannot argue against a business doing what is required of them: making money!

> Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.


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mjyoung




I don't think most of your complaints are really valid. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean that it's wrong.

Overall I think Quesada and Marvel have done a great job. Sure, some of the things I don't like (BND, the X-Men), but some of the things they have done are just so much better than any ideas I could come up with (New Avengers, Iron Fist, Hercules) that I can put away my personal feelings and see what a great job Marvel is doing.

But just to play along and give me complaints and ways to improve.

1) More focus on Minority Characters. There is a severe lack of both original and good minority characters at Marvel right now. At the very least, there should at least be one original female character (50% of the American population), one black character (~15%), and one hispanic (~15%) character all starring the their own ongoings. Note that She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel are derivitives of male characters, and that the Black Panther isn't "black" but African. The assumingly unintentional racism at Marvel has gotten to the point that a black character automatically has to have an interracial relationship in order to become interesting. Seriously, there isn't a popular black character out there that hasn't had an interracial relationship (no clue about the Falcon, but then again I can't name any of his girlfriends). DC use to have a black character on every team (John Stewart, Cyborg, Mr. Terrific, etc), all great characters, and that is something that Marvel should strive for. And when you look at Marvel, black characters are constantly getting killed (Black Goliath, Maggot, Skin, Synch, Night Thrasher, Tag, etc).

2) Titles with No Purpose. There are a number of titles out there that just don't have a purpose, or a bad purpose, or just an badly defined one. X-Factor, She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, etc are examples of those. Other titles like Iron Man:Director of Shield, Wolverine Origins, or Punisher WJ are just titles that aren't necessary. Every title that comes out should have a purpose, and not just be put out to tell stories of a certain character. Each title should be unique, so that you can't just tell interchange a character in a story depending on what title it is.

3) Not Making the Most of the Movies. There should be one Iron Man title right now, and that title should be the best it can be. It needs to tell a story that appeals to the average person. Same with the Hulk. There should only be one Hulk title out right now and he should be green and be Bruce Banner.

4) The Destruction of the Ultimate Line. I liked the Ultimate line when it came out, but it needs to be put down now before it gets any worse. I remember when it started Bendis said that as soon as Spider-Man was going into space, the line needs to end. Well he went to another dimension, which is basically the same thing, so it needs to end. Of course, there were lots of good things about the titles, but we can just transfer those good ideas over to the regular line.

5) Lack of New and Original Characters. Similar to no. 1, there should be at least one title out right now starring a new character that is original. Invincible at Image is a great example of a new original character that works. So it can be done. Put a solid creative team on the title, and guarantee at least 18 issues for the fans. It would be even better if these new characters could fill a particular niche that Marvel is missing right now, like a detective.

6) Improve the B-list Characters. Iron Fist was a book that has been great so far, but a new creative team is going to kill it. Same with Moon Knight. These B-list characters must have a solid creative team for a set period of time (at least 18 issues) so that they can prove themselves to the readers. Alot of B-list titles aren't even that good, like She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, Black Panther, New Warriors, Exiles, etc. Marvel needs to re-evaluate those titles, and reboot them with new teams if they have to. Other B-list characters deserve more spotlight, perhaps in a miniseries, like Namor, WonderMan, Black Widow, Luke Cage, Silver Surfer, Dr. Strange, etc. For instance, the new Ant-Man seems to have a strong fan base, so give him a 4 issue miniseries and see what happens.

7) New series with Popular Characters. I understand that you can't get Heinberg to do a new Young Avengers series, but get someone else to do it and let Heinberg supervise it. Marvel is letting the good will built up from the series just disappear.


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MysteryMan




> Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.

The Skrulls infiltrated loooong before SHRA...they infiltrated under Fury's watch.


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MysteryMan




> Several things Marvel has done has made me say what the hell. First,you kill off the living legend Captian amercia. Second, you have Iron Man betray his friends of his own free will and form some secrect cabal that ended up making the world more dangerous and along with the us goverment and the SHRA made the skrulls job easier in invading earth.Spider Man made a deal with that demon Mephestio(Spiderman is not Johnny Blaze for christ sake). The explaination for what the demon did for Spidey makes no sense with somehow spidey lost his other powers,organic webing, and a boat load of experience and character development. He is back to being a rookie agian. A divorce is awlfull but making a deal with a demom isn't. My favorite chracter is Hulk and with a stroke of a pen the writer took away all his chracter development from wwh and PH by making him even stupider then stupid hulk ever was and introducing Red Hulk who in hulk 4 kickded stupid hulk like a goverment mule . It would have been better if we had Red Hulk v WWH/ Since both are powerful and proably equal it would be a battle of thinking and skills which would have been funner to watch.

The Skrulls infiltrated loooong before SHRA...they infiltrated under Fury's watch.


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autochron




> The Skrulls infiltrated loooong before SHRA...they infiltrated under Fury's watch.

That's actually cool! Long live the Kree-Skrull War! ;\-\)


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Sandman


Member Since: Fri Oct 03, 2008


> The Skrulls infiltrated loooong before SHRA...they infiltrated under Fury's watch.

But he was the one who found out first and prepared for it.


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autochron




The "problems" that exist with Marvel? Hmmm... I think the definition of "problems" within certain parameters takes on different aspects depending on exactly who the observer is (talk about your convolutions!). To somebody who pays attention to finances, Marvel is a great success right now! Now that's not me, but from what I've read Marvel is doing quite well in a medium that is sinking as a viable means of capital gain. Also the Marvel live action movies are doing extremely well with Iron Man as a critical and financial success!

(Good reason to quit buying the comics. If you don't like the direction: why but them? Make Marvel KNOW that most of what they are putting out is shoddily written, "reality-TV" flavored crap.)

But now to the discerning, literate and critical mind Marvel Comics, the actual comic book line, is a shoddy, somewhat depressing and unsatisfying mess. The glory days of 1961-1981 are long gone and that wonderful Marvel Universe, the REAL Original Universe, that made the "Distinguished Competition" change it's tune back in the '80s is long gone! Yet... this beast is making money... A sad reflection on our jaded and psychically overloaded populace I believe.

And here's why! ...background music please... I should have created a PowerPoint... ;\-\)

And yes, I will follow-up this list with some stuff that I actually think is good with the Bullpen these days.

1) The capriciousness of the writers at Marvel has hit an all-time high in lows! Bendis' callous murder of characters such as the Vision is an example. I've read that the man doesn't "get" the synthezoid. Yeah right, good reason to kill off characters: because the concept is beyond your understanding. Then you have Ultron and Loki becoming women! Now while female villains are always a good idea, randomly making male characters female is somewhat... Questionable. Why not just use already established female characters! All the while within this panorama, this parade of dysfunction, various characters such as Wolverine and Iron Man are basically getting away with murder! As the heroes become villains, the villains become heroes and pet characters like "The Hood" become stars overnight. Yes I do think that moral relativism equates to weakness which leads me to...

2) Weren't these folks in long underwear supposed to uphold "values", as well as ethics and morals... Or at least show some introspection once in a while? Now don't get wrong I like Iron Man and the Wolverine a lot but how much depravity do we have to see them wallow in? I mean if I want to see that I'd rather read stories about a real champ: Bullseye! Not only is there a paucity of inspiration and ethic in Marvel Comics these days but even "deep thought" seems to be at an all-time low. Peter Parker makes pacts with the "devil". Stark, Richards and company engage in high-handed activity that would make even a Malthusian blush. The Hulk seems to have forgotten that "theres a good man inside."

3) Comic books as myth and literature. Those soaring, sweeping grand epics of yesteryear... Boy they were great huh? Can't find too much of that stuff these days with nearly every comic book playing out like a video game on paper. Yeah the picture look nice, there's some great art out there, but the writers really are not writing! You now have comic books that even consist of almost no dialog with almost less action! then when there is dialog it reads like "Survivor 39 meets Jerry Springer!" Trash-talk central! There are exceptions, such as Ed Brubaker, but that is the exception not the rule. Read them. These things are dumbed down in a major way: no more references to Keats, Shakespeare or Nietzsche here folks! Nothing wrong with learning a little from a funny-book people! May Gerber rest in peace. God I miss that man.

4) Why was Captain Marvel brought back? That was cheap shot... Yeah the explanation was kind of cool... Kind of... But there already was a Captain Marvel: Genis-Vell! A true legacy character, Genis was being well established in the MU with David's wonderful series from a few years back and then... Nothing... Now he calls himself "Photon"... Or maybe he's dead. Then they brought back Mar-Vell or something. Who cares anymore right?

5) Continuity: it's like the pet rock. The Marvel Universe is the reason that DC has a Universe, or at least the Universe it has now. That wonderful, flowing organic thing called the Marvel Universe is now a mess of contradictions. I put the blame squarely on the heads of the editors here.

6) Why all the "events?" Couldn't the regular titles encompass events as well! I mean "The Coming of Galactus" was part of the regular Marvel line back then! Why does it seem like marketers run comic books these days?

7) Science in comics is generally ignored and not just at Marvel... Some writers try to bring forth scientific validity but it's rare... OK! It's a comic book but even comic books can teach you something while you have fun reading them! The lack of explanation for the Sentry's existence is my example here. The fact that he "vibrates" on a different "wavelength" a few micro-seconds ahead of the Universe at large is very interesting, yet its never been adequately explained.

OK, I'm about tired of this... Questions? Comments? Venting? Fire away!

But before I got, a few good things...

1) Marvel still has a sense of humor. When I do pick up a Marvel book I often find myself laughing, and not at the writing either! For instance that moment early on in the New Avengers when the team found itself naked in the Savage Land. Spidey makes like a comedian: funny stuff.

2) Ms. Marvel is finally coming into her own! Marvel has needed a strong woman character for a long time and it looks like she's the one. Yes she is sort of riding on Mar-Vell's coat-tails but not really... Because he's actually dead.

3) Minorities in Marvel comics. Yes let's be part of the real world now. Good to see Cage coming into his own as well... Although... Man... Make him Power Man again! I loved that comic book from the 70's where he drove home the point to Erik Josten that he... is... POWER MAN! Up his strength too! That's his thing.

4) In a new issue of the X-Men the writer, Morrison I think, quotes Son House lyrics. Just one of the reasons why Morrison's one of the best. Now if they would only get Gaiman to write an ongoing...


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SEHS66




I think it is a lack of understanding of whom these characters are and what the represent. There seems to be the inability, by the writers and editors at marvel, to write and produce characters that are more noble than they are. They seem to want to take the "hero" out of super-hero. I see the same problem at DC also. Not quite as bad but it is there.

Another thing that comes to mind is the fans. Fans who buy books that they don't like. If we don't like the direction of a book we need to quit buying it. That is the only true measure of how we like a book. The sales. Poor sales will cause a change. Good sales won't.


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autochron




> Another thing that comes to mind is the fans. Fans who buy books that they don't like. If we don't like the direction of a book we need to quit buying it. That is the only true measure of how we like a book. The sales. Poor sales will cause a change. Good sales won't.

One of the most accurate things said here.


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Jase




> The "problems" that exist with Marvel? Hmmm... I think the definition of "problems" within certain parameters takes on different aspects depending on exactly who the observer is (talk about your convolutions!). To somebody who pays attention to finances, Marvel is a great success right now! Now that's not me, but from what I've read Marvel is doing quite well in a medium that is sinking as a viable means of capital gain. Also the Marvel live action movies are doing extremely well with Iron Man as a critical and financial success!
>
> (Good reason to quit buying the comics. If you don't like the direction: why but them? Make Marvel KNOW that most of what they are putting out is shoddily written, "reality-TV" flavored crap.)
>
> But now to the discerning, literate and critical mind Marvel Comics, the actual comic book line, is a shoddy, somewhat depressing and unsatisfying mess. The glory days of 1961-1981 are long gone and that wonderful Marvel Universe, the REAL Original Universe, that made the "Distinguished Competition" change it's tune back in the '80s is long gone! Yet... this beast is making money... A sad reflection on our jaded and psychically overloaded populace I believe.
>
> And here's why! ...background music please... I should have created a PowerPoint... ;\-\)
>
> And yes, I will follow-up this list with some stuff that I actually think is good with the Bullpen these days.
>
> 1) The capriciousness of the writers at Marvel has hit an all-time high in lows! Bendis' callous murder of characters such as the Vision is an example. I've read that the man doesn't "get" the synthezoid. Yeah right, good reason to kill off characters: because the concept is beyond your understanding. Then you have Ultron and Loki becoming women! Now while female villains are always a good idea, randomly making male characters female is somewhat... Questionable. Why not just use already established female characters!

This is a tricky issue. With Ultron, 'he's' a robot, so the whole issue of gender is a moot one as far as he's concerned I suppose, yet throughtout the history of the character, he has always identified himself in male terms, as a son, as a father, as a husband - to then make him a female (if only in appearance if nothing else), well...I can't see the rationale. I don't see the motive or the reason or the why, and an obsession with Janet Van Dyne isn't enough to warrant such a complete makeover. I'd say Annihilation handled Ultron much better than Mighty Avengers did.

As for Loki though... to be fair, the source material for Marvel's version of Loki has him portrayed as a rather pansexual shapeshifter who's even given birth. Having the comic Loki take a few cues from the mythology isn't so out there IMO.

> All the while within this panorama, this parade of dysfunction, various characters such as Wolverine and Iron Man are basically getting away with murder! As the heroes become villains, the villains become heroes and pet characters like "The Hood" become stars overnight. Yes I do think that moral relativism equates to weakness which leads me to...
>
> 2) Weren't these folks in long underwear supposed to uphold "values", as well as ethics and morals... Or at least show some introspection once in a while? Now don't get wrong I like Iron Man and the Wolverine a lot but how much depravity do we have to see them wallow in? I mean if I want to see that I'd rather read stories about a real champ: Bullseye! Not only is there a paucity of inspiration and ethic in Marvel Comics these days but even "deep thought" seems to be at an all-time low. Peter Parker makes pacts with the "devil". Stark, Richards and company engage in high-handed activity that would make even a Malthusian blush. The Hulk seems to have forgotten that "theres a good man inside."
>
> 3) Comic books as myth and literature. Those soaring, sweeping grand epics of yesteryear... Boy they were great huh? Can't find too much of that stuff these days with nearly every comic book playing out like a video game on paper. Yeah the picture look nice, there's some great art out there, but the writers really are not writing! You now have comic books that even consist of almost no dialog with almost less action! then when there is dialog it reads like "Survivor 39 meets Jerry Springer!" Trash-talk central! There are exceptions, such as Ed Brubaker, but that is the exception not the rule. Read them. These things are dumbed down in a major way: no more references to Keats, Shakespeare or Nietzsche here folks! Nothing wrong with learning a little from a funny-book people! May Gerber rest in peace. God I miss that man.
>
> 4) Why was Captain Marvel brought back? That was cheap shot... Yeah the explanation was kind of cool... Kind of... But there already was a Captain Marvel: Genis-Vell!

Heck, there was already (and still is) a Monica Rambeau, or even a Phylla-Vell...

> A true legacy character, Genis was being well established in the MU with David's wonderful series from a few years back and then... Nothing... Now he calls himself "Photon"... Or maybe he's dead. Then they brought back Mar-Vell or something. Who cares anymore right?
>
> 5) Continuity: it's like the pet rock. The Marvel Universe is the reason that DC has a Universe, or at least the Universe it has now. That wonderful, flowing organic thing called the Marvel Universe is now a mess of contradictions. I put the blame squarely on the heads of the editors here.
>
> 6) Why all the "events?" Couldn't the regular titles encompass events as well! I mean "The Coming of Galactus" was part of the regular Marvel line back then! Why does it seem like marketers run comic books these days?
>
> 7) Science in comics is generally ignored and not just at Marvel... Some writers try to bring forth scientific validity but it's rare... OK! It's a comic book but even comic books can teach you something while you have fun reading them! The lack of explanation for the Sentry's existence is my example here. The fact that he "vibrates" on a different "wavelength" a few micro-seconds ahead of the Universe at large is very interesting, yet its never been adequately explained.
>

For me, one of my problems with The Sentry isn't scientific validity (it's a rather questionable charge to throw at superhero fiction, I think) but rather: what the hell is it he's supposed to be able to do? I've never really gotten a clear picture of what his power set specifically contained or what his limits are aside from being crazy sometimes.

> OK, I'm about tired of this... Questions? Comments? Venting? Fire away!
>
> But before I got, a few good things...
>
> 1) Marvel still has a sense of humor. When I do pick up a Marvel book I often find myself laughing, and not at the writing either! For instance that moment early on in the New Avengers when the team found itself naked in the Savage Land. Spidey makes like a comedian: funny stuff.
>
> 2) Ms. Marvel is finally coming into her own! Marvel has needed a strong woman character for a long time and it looks like she's the one. Yes she is sort of riding on Mar-Vell's coat-tails but not really... Because he's actually dead.
>
> 3) Minorities in Marvel comics. Yes let's be part of the real world now. Good to see Cage coming into his own as well... Although... Man... Make him Power Man again! I loved that comic book from the 70's where he drove home the point to Erik Josten that he... is... POWER MAN! Up his strength too! That's his thing.
>
> 4) In a new issue of the X-Men the writer, Morrison I think, quotes Son House lyrics. Just one of the reasons why Morrison's one of the best. Now if they would only get Gaiman to write an ongoing...

Morrison doesn't write for Marvel anymore, and hasn't since New X-Men ended. And I presume Gaiman is too busy with novels and movies to ever write a regular ongoing series again...





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Blargh




> I don't think most of your complaints are really valid. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean that it's wrong.
>
> Overall I think Quesada and Marvel have done a great job. Sure, some of the things I don't like (BND, the X-Men), but some of the things they have done are just so much better than any ideas I could come up with (New Avengers, Iron Fist, Hercules) that I can put away my personal feelings and see what a great job Marvel is doing.

Just to pick one part from this post, but X-Men? The X-books have overall been very interesting, with only two outright bad titles (Young X-Men, Ultimate X-Men) and the meidocre ones (X-Force, Cable, Origins) at least have a chance at being good. Legacy and Uncanny are awesome, especially since Uncanny is essentially in a filler arc.


> 1) More focus on Minority Characters. There is a severe lack of both original and good minority characters at Marvel right now. At the very least, there should at least be one original female character (50% of the American population), one black character (~15%), and one hispanic (~15%) character all starring the their own ongoings. Note that She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel are derivitives of male characters, and that the Black Panther isn't "black" but African. The assumingly unintentional racism at Marvel has gotten to the point that a black character automatically has to have an interracial relationship in order to become interesting. Seriously, there isn't a popular black character out there that hasn't had an interracial relationship (no clue about the Falcon, but then again I can't name any of his girlfriends). DC use to have a black character on every team (John Stewart, Cyborg, Mr. Terrific, etc), all great characters, and that is something that Marvel should strive for. And when you look at Marvel, black characters are constantly getting killed (Black Goliath, Maggot, Skin, Synch, Night Thrasher, Tag, etc).

I don't think Marvel, or any media company, should have to live up to the standards of demographics. If there's a story that can be told by a minority character, great, but they shouldn't shoehorn in minority characters just to have proper representation. And while She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel may be derived from prominent male characters, they can hold their own books without their namesakes being in them.

>
> 2) Titles with No Purpose. There are a number of titles out there that just don't have a purpose, or a bad purpose, or just an badly defined one. X-Factor, She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, etc are examples of those. Other titles like Iron Man:Director of Shield, Wolverine Origins, or Punisher WJ are just titles that aren't necessary. Every title that comes out should have a purpose, and not just be put out to tell stories of a certain character. Each title should be unique, so that you can't just tell interchange a character in a story depending on what title it is.

I think X-Facor has been on the upswing for quite a while, and I'm not a big PAD fan. Ms. Marvel is written by Reed, one of Marvel's many new talents, and She-Hulk...well, at least it has the potential of being good. Heavily disagree about Iron Man and War Journal aren't necessary, since they both tell very vital tales in the Marvel Universe. Origins just needs a writer who isn't horrible.
>
> 3) Not Making the Most of the Movies. There should be one Iron Man title right now, and that title should be the best it can be. It needs to tell a story that appeals to the average person. Same with the Hulk. There should only be one Hulk title out right now and he should be green and be Bruce Banner.

I agree that they dropped the ball on Hulk promotion, but it's pretty much a fact that the movies bring few people into comic shops, and even fewer that stay. The best move is to put out hardcovers and trade paperbacks, which I'm sure they did.

>
> 4) The Destruction of the Ultimate Line. I liked the Ultimate line when it came out, but it needs to be put down now before it gets any worse. I remember when it started Bendis said that as soon as Spider-Man was going into space, the line needs to end. Well he went to another dimension, which is basically the same thing, so it needs to end. Of course, there were lots of good things about the titles, but we can just transfer those good ideas over to the regular line.

See my other post, but essentially I think it needs a regime change, not a universal destruction. Also, when did Ultimate Spidey go to an alternate dimension? Squadron Supreme?
>
> 5) Lack of New and Original Characters. Similar to no. 1, there should be at least one title out right now starring a new character that is original. Invincible at Image is a great example of a new original character that works. So it can be done. Put a solid creative team on the title, and guarantee at least 18 issues for the fans. It would be even better if these new characters could fill a particular niche that Marvel is missing right now, like a detective.

There are two problems with this one:

1. There are tons of characters in the MU that are horribly underused and could use a good writer. I'd much rather get a revitalized Tombstone, Black Tarantula, or Hammerhead than yet another crime lord.

2. Modern creations, even though they technically belong to the company, are something other writers are heistant to use, as Bendis has pointed out. He's even a bit guilty of it too, having asked permission to use The Hood (Vaughn) and Sentry (Jenkins).
>
> 6) Improve the B-list Characters. Iron Fist was a book that has been great so far, but a new creative team is going to kill it. Same with Moon Knight. These B-list characters must have a solid creative team for a set period of time (at least 18 issues) so that they can prove themselves to the readers. Alot of B-list titles aren't even that good, like She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, Black Panther, New Warriors, Exiles, etc. Marvel needs to re-evaluate those titles, and reboot them with new teams if they have to. Other B-list characters deserve more spotlight, perhaps in a miniseries, like Namor, WonderMan, Black Widow, Luke Cage, Silver Surfer, Dr. Strange, etc. For instance, the new Ant-Man seems to have a strong fan base, so give him a 4 issue miniseries and see what happens.

The new Ant-Man DID have a solo title that lasted for twelve issues. The sales were pretty horrible. I think it even dipped below Spider-Girl.
>



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mjyoung




> > I don't think most of your complaints are really valid. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean that it's wrong.
> >
> > Overall I think Quesada and Marvel have done a great job. Sure, some of the things I don't like (BND, the X-Men), but some of the things they have done are just so much better than any ideas I could come up with (New Avengers, Iron Fist, Hercules) that I can put away my personal feelings and see what a great job Marvel is doing.
>
> Just to pick one part from this post, but X-Men? The X-books have overall been very interesting, with only two outright bad titles (Young X-Men, Ultimate X-Men) and the meidocre ones (X-Force, Cable, Origins) at least have a chance at being good. Legacy and Uncanny are awesome, especially since Uncanny is essentially in a filler arc.

Both the X-Men and BND are both examples of things that I don't like personally, but I can see their appeal to others. If I were in charge of the characters, it's just not how I would do them.

>
> > 1) More focus on Minority Characters. There is a severe lack of both original and good minority characters at Marvel right now. At the very least, there should at least be one original female character (50% of the American population), one black character (~15%), and one hispanic (~15%) character all starring the their own ongoings. Note that She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel are derivitives of male characters, and that the Black Panther isn't "black" but African. The assumingly unintentional racism at Marvel has gotten to the point that a black character automatically has to have an interracial relationship in order to become interesting. Seriously, there isn't a popular black character out there that hasn't had an interracial relationship (no clue about the Falcon, but then again I can't name any of his girlfriends). DC use to have a black character on every team (John Stewart, Cyborg, Mr. Terrific, etc), all great characters, and that is something that Marvel should strive for. And when you look at Marvel, black characters are constantly getting killed (Black Goliath, Maggot, Skin, Synch, Night Thrasher, Tag, etc).
>
> I don't think Marvel, or any media company, should have to live up to the standards of demographics. If there's a story that can be told by a minority character, great, but they shouldn't shoehorn in minority characters just to have proper representation. And while She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel may be derived from prominent male characters, they can hold their own books without their namesakes being in them.

I don't think they should be exact, but I think they should try to aim for it. Comics have been dominated by white males since it's beginnings, so it's no coincidence that the fans are mostly white males. Women make up 50% of the American population, and the percentage of Marvel females is no where near that. I don't see how you can seriously say that there shouldn't be more minority characters.

As for your other point, how many people do you think just buy She-Hulk because of her connection to the Hulk? I am willing to bet that it's alot.

> > 2) Titles with No Purpose. There are a number of titles out there that just don't have a purpose, or a bad purpose, or just an badly defined one. X-Factor, She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, etc are examples of those. Other titles like Iron Man:Director of Shield, Wolverine Origins, or Punisher WJ are just titles that aren't necessary. Every title that comes out should have a purpose, and not just be put out to tell stories of a certain character. Each title should be unique, so that you can't just tell interchange a character in a story depending on what title it is.
>
> I think X-Facor has been on the upswing for quite a while, and I'm not a big PAD fan. Ms. Marvel is written by Reed, one of Marvel's many new talents, and She-Hulk...well, at least it has the potential of being good. Heavily disagree about Iron Man and War Journal aren't necessary, since they both tell very vital tales in the Marvel Universe. Origins just needs a writer who isn't horrible.

What's the purpose of X-Factor? Originally they were suppose to be an investigation group, then they became the protectors of MutantTown, and now I don't know what they do. It's a title that lacks a good purpose.

Ms. Marvel and She-Hulk still don't have a good purpose. What's the purpose of Ms. Marvel? Why should I read a Ms. Marvel story if I can read an Iron Man one?

There is no difference between IM DofS and IIM. They both tell the same exact stories.

> > 3) Not Making the Most of the Movies. There should be one Iron Man title right now, and that title should be the best it can be. It needs to tell a story that appeals to the average person. Same with the Hulk. There should only be one Hulk title out right now and he should be green and be Bruce Banner.
>
> I agree that they dropped the ball on Hulk promotion, but it's pretty much a fact that the movies bring few people into comic shops, and even fewer that stay. The best move is to put out hardcovers and trade paperbacks, which I'm sure they did.

See I disagree. First, I think movies help to bring old fans back in. Second, I think the movies help to create interest in the characters so that young fans care about them, and then get subscriptions, digests, tpbs, etc.

But I don't think 20 year olds are going to start picking up comics from watching a movie or anything.

> > 4) The Destruction of the Ultimate Line. I liked the Ultimate line when it came out, but it needs to be put down now before it gets any worse. I remember when it started Bendis said that as soon as Spider-Man was going into space, the line needs to end. Well he went to another dimension, which is basically the same thing, so it needs to end. Of course, there were lots of good things about the titles, but we can just transfer those good ideas over to the regular line.
>
> See my other post, but essentially I think it needs a regime change, not a universal destruction. Also, when did Ultimate Spidey go to an alternate dimension? Squadron Supreme?

There are just too many things that are wrong with it. The Ultimate line had a great original purpose, but that purpose doesn't exist anymore. As soon as the stories become confusing and uninteresting, the line fails. And that is where we are now. Another place they went wrong was that they started to try and tell the most shocking stories instead of telling the best stories (death of Gwen Stacey, gay Colossus, incest Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch, etC).

Spider-Man went to another dimension in the Ultimate Power miniseries.

> > 5) Lack of New and Original Characters. Similar to no. 1, there should be at least one title out right now starring a new character that is original. Invincible at Image is a great example of a new original character that works. So it can be done. Put a solid creative team on the title, and guarantee at least 18 issues for the fans. It would be even better if these new characters could fill a particular niche that Marvel is missing right now, like a detective.
>
> There are two problems with this one:
>
> 1. There are tons of characters in the MU that are horribly underused and could use a good writer. I'd much rather get a revitalized Tombstone, Black Tarantula, or Hammerhead than yet another crime lord.

It's not an either or situation. They can do both. There have been less new characters in the 00s then there were in the 90s. You can have both new characters, and revitalized older characters at the same time.

> 2. Modern creations, even though they technically belong to the company, are something other writers are heistant to use, as Bendis has pointed out. He's even a bit guilty of it too, having asked permission to use The Hood (Vaughn) and Sentry (Jenkins).

But that is a problem you can easily fix. And again, both of those characters were created in separate miniseries, and in the Sentry's case, was just a one story character.

> > 6) Improve the B-list Characters. Iron Fist was a book that has been great so far, but a new creative team is going to kill it. Same with Moon Knight. These B-list characters must have a solid creative team for a set period of time (at least 18 issues) so that they can prove themselves to the readers. Alot of B-list titles aren't even that good, like She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, Black Panther, New Warriors, Exiles, etc. Marvel needs to re-evaluate those titles, and reboot them with new teams if they have to. Other B-list characters deserve more spotlight, perhaps in a miniseries, like Namor, WonderMan, Black Widow, Luke Cage, Silver Surfer, Dr. Strange, etc. For instance, the new Ant-Man seems to have a strong fan base, so give him a 4 issue miniseries and see what happens.
>
> The new Ant-Man DID have a solo title that lasted for twelve issues. The sales were pretty horrible. I think it even dipped below Spider-Girl.

Ant-Man had an ongoing that came out a long time ago (comparatively). Give him a 6 issue mini and see how it goes. I'm not saying he deserves an ongoing or anything.


Posted with Mozilla Firefox 3.0 on Windows XP
MysteryMan




> > The Skrulls infiltrated loooong before SHRA...they infiltrated under Fury's watch.
>
> But he was the one who found out first and prepared for it.

..I mean come on please why arn't people giving him heck for just leaving all those other heroes out to dry and all defenseless without that knowledge.

Fury is worse then the Illuminati in just doing what he thinks is best...but he gets a free ride why?


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Grey Gargoyle




They are clueless : they don't know what is the best way to adapt themselves to the current evolution of the comics market.

Thus, they are trying every idea which comes to mind, one after the other.

It is a dilemma because they are the market's leader.
Thus, everything they do is a reflection of the market.


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CyberCoyote

Moderator

Location: The Negative Zone
Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 4,556



> I think it is a lack of understanding of whom these characters are and what the represent. There seems to be the inability, by the writers and editors at marvel, to write and produce characters that are more noble than they are. They seem to want to take the "hero" out of super-hero. I see the same problem at DC also. Not quite as bad but it is there.
>
> Another thing that comes to mind is the fans. Fans who buy books that they don't like. If we don't like the direction of a book we need to quit buying it. That is the only true measure of how we like a book. The sales. Poor sales will cause a change. Good sales won't.

Used to be my signature here..
"I don't think there's such a thing as a hero. It's a lovely idea and this isn't meant to be cynical, but I think people are just people who are capable of very good or very bad things.... " Mark Millar: Writer of Super Hero comic books

Folks argue that heroes need flaws. true. But they don't have to be as totally whacked out as the enemy.





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