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little kon-el




All Star Superman #8 introduces two new Kryptonian astronauts who take Superman's place when he was stuck in the Bizarro World. These two astronauts are cocky and push Superman around until they realize that kryptonite poisoning has left them sick and dying. Superman puts them into the Phantom Zone in order to save them, giving them both a purpose and their gratitude.

What I loved about it was that it pointed out something that is kind of lost in the latest Superman stories: he is a scientist son and that is why he doesn't interfere with changing the world dramatically.

I thought that was a brilliant insight as to what makes Superman tick, but also what differentiates him from other Kryptonians. The Kryptonians depicted in All Star Superman were Astronauts who were very gung-ho and pretty much calling Superman a wimp because he is the son of a scientist. This tells you a lot about Kryptonian culture: they had this huge hubris and a chip on their shoulder that wasn't patient or observant of the world. It finally makes sense that Krypton wouldn't listen to a scientist...scientists are geeks compared to the gung-ho Astronauts.

Kal-el has both of these things, because he is the son of a scientist, and this becomes his defining characteristic. He doesn't barge into things. He takes his time to make sure he gets things right. He doesn't just break Kandor out...he waits patiently and tries his best to find a way to enlarge Kandor without killing inhabitants. He doesn't recreate Krypton on Earth, he shows the world through example and through his actions.

I thought this particular issue showed a facet of Superman that hasn't been shown...the patience and care of a scientist.

- l.k.


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Astro




> All Star Superman #8 introduces two new Kryptonian astronauts who take Superman's place when he was stuck in the Bizarro World. These two astronauts are cocky and push Superman around until they realize that kryptonite poisoning has left them sick and dying. Superman puts them into the Phantom Zone in order to save them, giving them both a purpose and their gratitude.
>
> What I loved about it was that it pointed out something that is kind of lost in the latest Superman stories: he is a scientist son and that is why he doesn't interfere with changing the world dramatically.
>
> I thought that was a brilliant insight as to what makes Superman tick, but also what differentiates him from other Kryptonians. The Kryptonians depicted in All Star Superman were Astronauts who were very gung-ho and pretty much calling Superman a wimp because he is the son of a scientist. This tells you a lot about Kryptonian culture: they had this huge hubris and a chip on their shoulder that wasn't patient or observant of the world. It finally makes sense that Krypton wouldn't listen to a scientist...scientists are geeks compared to the gung-ho Astronauts.

It doesn't make that much sense, when you consider that Jor El wasn't believed by the SCIENCE council, which had replaced the Imperialist war council.

These Astronauts seemed to have come from some time out of Krypton's past, before space travel and colonization had become illegal.

From that perspective, their attitude makes sense, but it doesn't really shed any extra light on in the Jor-El/Science Council disagreement.

>
> Kal-el has both of these things, because he is the son of a scientist, and this becomes his defining characteristic. He doesn't barge into things. He takes his time to make sure he gets things right. He doesn't just break Kandor out...he waits patiently and tries his best to find a way to enlarge Kandor without killing inhabitants. He doesn't recreate Krypton on Earth, he shows the world through example and through his actions.

In part, if you believe strongly in the power of genetics.

But he's also the son of a farmer, simple and hardworking, who bends the land to his will to serve his needs, and the needs of the people he serves.

So in that sense, it is very counter to what might be the perceived nature of Superman's family that he is so...reactive.




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Blue Beetle




> In part, if you believe strongly in the power of genetics.
>
> But he's also the son of a farmer, simple and hardworking, who bends the land to his will to serve his needs, and the needs of the people he serves.
>
> So in that sense, it is very counter to what might be the perceived nature of Superman's family that he is so...reactive.




Action Comics #858 SPOILERS

Note the particular comic I'm spoiling:

Action Comics #858 SPOILERS


.
.
.
.
.
.

So here's my comment:

DC has reinstated a crucial component of the Silver Age mythos. Clark, as a boy, spent time and had adventures with the Legion of Super-Heroes in the 30th century. I would argue that this had as much of an impact on his world view as anything else we could name. To paraphrase Prince: Clark has seen the future and it works! He knows for a fact that in at least one possible future, his approach of leading strictly by example bore good fruit a thousandfold.



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little kon-el




> > All Star Superman #8 introduces two new Kryptonian astronauts who take Superman's place when he was stuck in the Bizarro World. These two astronauts are cocky and push Superman around until they realize that kryptonite poisoning has left them sick and dying. Superman puts them into the Phantom Zone in order to save them, giving them both a purpose and their gratitude.
> >
> > What I loved about it was that it pointed out something that is kind of lost in the latest Superman stories: he is a scientist son and that is why he doesn't interfere with changing the world dramatically.
> >
> > I thought that was a brilliant insight as to what makes Superman tick, but also what differentiates him from other Kryptonians. The Kryptonians depicted in All Star Superman were Astronauts who were very gung-ho and pretty much calling Superman a wimp because he is the son of a scientist. This tells you a lot about Kryptonian culture: they had this huge hubris and a chip on their shoulder that wasn't patient or observant of the world. It finally makes sense that Krypton wouldn't listen to a scientist...scientists are geeks compared to the gung-ho Astronauts.
>
> It doesn't make that much sense, when you consider that Jor El wasn't believed by the SCIENCE council, which had replaced the Imperialist war council.
>
> These Astronauts seemed to have come from some time out of Krypton's past, before space travel and colonization had become illegal.
>
> From that perspective, their attitude makes sense, but it doesn't really shed any extra light on in the Jor-El/Science Council disagreement.
>

Maybe the bravado was still a part of the Science Council. Depending on the past that Morrison might be drawing from, I could still see the Science Council being very arrogant with their technology. They believed they could control their world, not observing that their world was coming to an end. Jor-el's always been seen as rebellious because he was very humble (the world was coming to an end), observant (he had proof that the world was going to end), and bold (he sent his only son away) no matter what incarnation, so that might show the main schism between the two group. Jor-el was a scientist who was looked down upon because he didn't have the arrogance and presumption that the older establishment had.

> >
> > Kal-el has both of these things, because he is the son of a scientist, and this becomes his defining characteristic. He doesn't barge into things. He takes his time to make sure he gets things right. He doesn't just break Kandor out...he waits patiently and tries his best to find a way to enlarge Kandor without killing inhabitants. He doesn't recreate Krypton on Earth, he shows the world through example and through his actions.
>
> In part, if you believe strongly in the power of genetics.
>
> But he's also the son of a farmer, simple and hardworking, who bends the land to his will to serve his needs, and the needs of the people he serves.
>
> So in that sense, it is very counter to what might be the perceived nature of Superman's family that he is so...reactive.
>

He may be the son of a farmer, but he is also the son of a scientist. His main struggle is trying to live up to his father, Jor-el...a father he only knows through the debris of his culture or through recollections from other devises (like journals) and other people (like possibly lar gand). His whole devotion to Krypton is so he can become closer to his father and mother that he never knew. You can even see his struggles against villains (like Lex Luthor...the most brillaint scientist on Earth like Jor-el was the most brilliant scientist on Krypton) as Superman trying to both identify and defeat the image of his father.

- l.k.



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Johnny Sarcastic




> He may be the son of a farmer, but he is also the son of a scientist. His main struggle is trying to live up to his father, Jor-el...a father he only knows through the debris of his culture or through recollections from other devises (like journals) and other people (like possibly lar gand). His whole devotion to Krypton is so he can become closer to his father and mother that he never knew. You can even see his struggles against villains (like Lex Luthor...the most brillaint scientist on Earth like Jor-el was the most brilliant scientist on Krypton) as Superman trying to both identify and defeat the image of his father.

I never took any of that away from Superman stories, really. He's always been more human than Kryptonian to me (except for maybe the movies). His advice is always, always, ALWAYS human based. Practically every issue we see him talking to Lois, or pa, or Bruce. He doesn't really spend a lot of time science-ing it up.

I always percieved his interest in Krypton sort of similar as your intrest in your dead great-grandparents - you want to know where you're from, but it doesn't HAVE to influence where you're going.


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Blue Beetle




> I never took any of that away from Superman stories, really. He's always been more human than Kryptonian to me (except for maybe the movies). His advice is always, always, ALWAYS human based. Practically every issue we see him talking to Lois, or pa, or Bruce. He doesn't really spend a lot of time science-ing it up.
>
> I always percieved his interest in Krypton sort of similar as your intrest in your dead great-grandparents - you want to know where you're from, but it doesn't HAVE to influence where you're going.


I agree. I think the crucial aspect of Clark's psyche is the fact that he was raised by loving, stable, wise parents. If instead he had been raised in an orphanage, his outlook might have been different. He might have grasped at his Kryptonian heritage as a way to have a sense of identity.

I will say this also, however. I think if some villian had seriously threatened or actually harmed Kara or Chris, even before Clark had gotten to know either one to any depth, that villain might possibly have died at Clark's hand.




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little kon-el





> I agree. I think the crucial aspect of Clark's psyche is the fact that he was raised by loving, stable, wise parents. If instead he had been raised in an orphanage, his outlook might have been different. He might have grasped at his Kryptonian heritage as a way to have a sense of identity.
>
While I do think that is part of how he turned out, his sense of loss is still a part of his character. Weisinger created very interesting stories about Superman and Krypton, with a sense of loss that can never quite be fullfilled...despite traveling back through time or retrieving old memories. While Jon and Martha gave him a stable home and loving parents, I think a part of him will always wonder and at least try to live up to the standards of his father and mother. Consider that, in his fortress of solitude, his statues aren't of Jon or Martha, but of Jor-el and Lara.

Without that sense of loss or need to connect, I think you lose alot of what makes Superman an interesting character. Jon and Martha taught superman to love humanity but Lara and Jor-el gave him the culture and heritage of an entire planet to show him that he is different from humanity.

- l.k.


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Blue Beetle




> While I do think that is part of how he turned out, his sense of loss is still a part of his character. Weisinger created very interesting stories about Superman and Krypton, with a sense of loss that can never quite be fullfilled...despite traveling back through time or retrieving old memories. While Jon and Martha gave him a stable home and loving parents, I think a part of him will always wonder and at least try to live up to the standards of his father and mother. Consider that, in his fortress of solitude, his statues aren't of Jon or Martha, but of Jor-el and Lara.


I think he excludes Jon and Martha to prevent an inadvertant discovery of his secret identity.


> Without that sense of loss or need to connect, I think you lose alot of what makes Superman an interesting character. Jon and Martha taught superman to love humanity but Lara and Jor-el gave him the culture and heritage of an entire planet to show him that he is different from humanity.


Well, let me ask you, what does Clark actually do, that you would describe as Kryptonian?



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Niddle




> > While I do think that is part of how he turned out, his sense of loss is still a part of his character. Weisinger created very interesting stories about Superman and Krypton, with a sense of loss that can never quite be fullfilled...despite traveling back through time or retrieving old memories. While Jon and Martha gave him a stable home and loving parents, I think a part of him will always wonder and at least try to live up to the standards of his father and mother. Consider that, in his fortress of solitude, his statues aren't of Jon or Martha, but of Jor-el and Lara.
>
>
> I think he excludes Jon and Martha to prevent an inadvertant discovery of his secret identity.

Plus, I'm sure Clark has plenty of photos of the Kents, including in his wallet, no doubt.

Where can he display anything having to do with Jor-El and Lara?

The apartment is Clark's home. The Fortress is Superman's place, and it makes sense that it's there he'll accent the Kryptonian side of his dual heritage. (Especially since that whole WORLD no longer exists. The Kents don't need a memorial yet. A memorial to Jor-El and Lara is all Clark can do for them.)

>
>
> > Without that sense of loss or need to connect, I think you lose alot of what makes Superman an interesting character. Jon and Martha taught superman to love humanity but Lara and Jor-el gave him the culture and heritage of an entire planet to show him that he is different from humanity.
>
>
> Well, let me ask you, what does Clark actually do, that you would describe as Kryptonian?


Putting ketchup on Beef Bourguignon?
(Or is that still "Birthrighted" out of continuity by vegetarianism? \:\-D )


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omike015




> Putting ketchup on Beef Bourguignon?
> (Or is that still "Birthrighted" out of continuity by vegetarianism? \:\-D )

Perry: "You and Jimmy had lunch again today."
Clark: "Cheeseburgers. No onions on mine. They give me indigestion."
-Action Comics #858


Thank you, Geoff Johns.

omike015
:-|



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Johnny Sarcastic




> Perry: "You and Jimmy had lunch again today."
> Clark: "Cheeseburgers. No onions on mine. They give me indigestion."
> -Action Comics #858

>
> Thank you, Geoff Johns.

Hear, hear.




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