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Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
In Reply To

Subj: Re: Essential Membership
Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 at 11:02:41 am EDT (Viewed 289 times)
Reply Subj: Essential Membership
Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 at 12:22:08 am EDT (Viewed 376 times)

    The "miss the old avengers" post revealed a few posts I find odd. Some say that the avengers MUST always have the big three of Cap, Thor, and Iron Man. Others assume the team should mostly be the core nine (or close to it) of thor, cap, ironman, hawkeye, pym, wasp, vision, scarlet witch, and wonderman.

    Though I do say I want at least one or two of the Core nine in my avengers I find it odd how many people discount any other avengers as fake.

    Mind you their are some Avengers whose membership I disagree with or dislike (Sentry, Wolverine, Ares, Moon Knight, Jessica Drew, etc.) But their are any second tier (black knight, she-hulk, hercules) and third tier (Justice, Firebird, Living Lightning) Avengers I enjoy and consider valid Avengers.

    This leads to a few questions I have.

    If you feel the Avengers MUST be composed of the BIG three or the core nine (or a group close to the core nine) why? Do you consider those second and third tier avengers not valid as members or not fitting the avengers feel?

    Any my other question is what do you consider traits that make someone avengers material?

    What I feel makes a person Avengers Material is the following.

    1. Heroic Acts: The character must act consistantly heroic. This means by both being willing to help, protect, and save others selflessly. And being willing and able to do so while on duty.

    2. Code Against Killing: Yes I took this ones name from a disadvantage in the Champions superhero RPG. An Avengers should be unwilling to kill and only resort to such in only the most extreme and unlikely of circumstances. And even then stooping to that level should be a burden to him and a decision not reached quickly.

    3. Relatively Stable: His mental state should be stable enough to be trusted in a position of power and authority. Sure almost every avenger ever has gone nuts at one time or other, but during his time as an avenger he must prove his stability and reliability in the role.

IMO it is not about membership. I think having a few mainstays on the team at any point is key, outside of a few story arcs, just to allow it to feel more connected. And the others being busy or something. To me the stories just feel different. They are not as fun at times as they were, and I think need to be. There have been some good dramatic moments in them but they are dramatic because we liked the characters dealing with them.

They are not marketing comics like they were so they are writting them to an older audience I think, but that said I miss a more consise story that seemed to have things every panel or so, and not a million splash pages and arcs lasting 6 or 7 books.

I think your standards are fine, and apply to many heroes. I do not necissarily thing that character x cannot be an Avenger. Some fit better than others but to me I just miss what the comic was. I almost feel that the dialgoue itself has dragged it down as many of the characters are jaded and honestly personalities overlap or have to be played up to much. And I think that makes a mess in the end. You nearly can change out any character for any other character and the book loses its soul. The Avengers still has action and big things happening in it, just to me it is not maximizing it, I just do not have as much of a reason to care.

This could be as much nastolgia on my part than anything but I can go back and read classic avengers runs and still like about everything. I feel I have no need to ever look at the modern books again. And I do not think it is just a modern mess. As I have loved some modern books like Annihilation, Ghost Rider, Captain Britain, Nova and so on. But to me they almost have that yesteryear feel to them and are not being set up soley for the graphic novel (with the exception of Ways part of Ghost Rider).

Look Raist bunnies...