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Post By
Blue Jay

In Reply To
Mr_Vespa

Subj: Re: Brown's death should have changed Batman!
Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 03:32:33 pm EST
Reply Subj: Re: Brown's death should have changed Batman!
Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 04:25:35 pm EST

Previous Post


> Apparently you did not read the comics. In the comics there is some dispute as to just how much Batman is to blame for Stephanie's death. When Batman got Stephanie to be Robin's replacement even Alfred thought that Batman might be doing this just as a way to manipulate Robin into coming back. Like you said Stephanie was not ready, but Batman knowing she was not ready still put her in the position of being the fourth Robin. This where Batman's actions come completely into question and even Batman later admits that he was under so much stress that he may not have been thinking right. After Stephanie's death, the whole Batman gang, including Oracle, Nightwing, and Robin 3 say that Batman really messed up and was completely irresponsible in making Stephanie Robin 4. After hearing this Batman does not utter a word.
>
> So there is a great deal of contention as to who is really to blame for Stephanie Brown's death. According to Batman it was Leslie, but according to Oracle, Nightwing, Robin 3, Alfred and Leslie it was Batman's fault. So, simply by number of votes it was Batman's fault.

So, they took a vote and decided it was Batman's fault? You realize how foolish that sounds? And yes, I did read the comic. While Alfred suspected that Steph as Robin was a play to manipulate Tim it was never fully established. And I spoke with Willingham (guys not a bad poker player and is a fun guy to have a brew with) who stated that was not his intention going into the story. So, you are left with a couple of interpretations as to why he made steph Robin. The fact remains, while making Steph Robin was a mistake, he rectified that error and told her under no uncertain terms that she was not continue her vigilante activities. That's like blaming a parent who repeatedly tells a child not to stick her finger in a wall socket only to have the child do just that the moment the parent's back was turned. Batman tried to provide Steph with training. Both when she was Spoiler and again when she was Robin. He determined that she did not have the make up to do the job and told her to quit. You want to blame someone, how about The Birds of Prey, Robin, or Batgirl, who kept encouraging her when they should have trusted Bruce's judgment on the matter.

>
> > Apparently you did not read the comics. In the comics there is some dispute as to just how much Batman is to blame for Stephanie's death. When Batman got Stephanie to be Robin's replacement even Alfred thought that Batman might be doing this just as a way to manipulate Robin into coming back. Like you said Stephanie was not ready, but Batman knowing she was not ready still put her in the position of being the fourth Robin. This where Batman's actions come completely into question and even Batman later admits that he was under so much stress that he may not have been thinking right. After Stephanie's death, the whole Batman gang, including Oracle, Nightwing, and Robin 3 say that Batman really messed up and was completely irresponsible in making Stephanie Robin 4. After hearing this Batman does not utter a word.
> >
> > So there is a great deal of contention as to who is really to blame for Stephanie Brown's death. According to Batman it was Leslie, but according to Oracle, Nightwing, Robin 3, Alfred and Leslie it was Batman's fault. So, simply by number of votes it was Batman's fault.
>
> So, they took a vote and decided it was Batman's fault? You realize how foolish that sounds? And yes, I did read the comic. While Alfred suspected that Steph as Robin was a play to manipulate Tim it was never fully established. And I spoke with Willingham (guys not a bad poker player and is a fun guy to have a brew with) who stated that was not his intention going into the story. So, you are left with a couple of interpretations as to why he made steph Robin. The fact remains, while making Steph Robin was a mistake, he rectified that error and told her under no uncertain terms that she was not continue her vigilante activities. That's like blaming a parent who repeatedly tells a child not to stick her finger in a wall socket only to have the child do just that the moment the parent's back was turned. Batman tried to provide Steph with training. Both when she was Spoiler and again when she was Robin. He determined that she did not have the make up to do the job and told her to quit. You want to blame someone, how about The Birds of Prey, Robin, or Batgirl, who kept encouraging her when they should have trusted Bruce's judgment on the matter.

I see your point of view, but it still reflects badly on Bruce. This was Bruce's fourth Robin, after all the mistakes he made with the previous Robins he should have known better and should have watched out better for Stephanie. Instead of giving her a normal life Bruce for some unexplained reason threw her unprepared into a world she was not ready for, trained her to live in that world and then expected her to leave that world behind when he himself cannot. This is quite egotistical, irresponsible and ludicrous.

However, DC are the real people to blame though as Wargames really makes no sense at all and is one of the worst chapters in Batman's life.


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