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Post By
Bucky

In Reply To
MichaelRGrimm

Subj: Re: Civil War#6 musings......SPOILERS
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 at 03:31:00 am EST
Reply Subj: Re: Civil War#6 musings......SPOILERS
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 at 12:35:20 am EST

Previous Post

> > Am I correct in the interpretation that Hulkling in the guise of Hank Pym is the spy in Tony's organization? Bear with me, I realize I am stating the obvious. Story inconsistancies throughout this issue give me pause in assuming this is comepletely accurate. Cap's team has known about Tigra, and I get the impression for longer than the duration of Hulkling's infiltration of IM's forces. To start CW 6, Hank is talking with Miriam Hill when a low level SHIELD agent interrupts them needing Pym's assistance. Obviously, the agent is Hulkling. In his own words Hulking states " ...Pym's been drugged and unconcious since I knocked him out and replaced him back in Arizona this morning." Tigra's been the spy for over a week. I get the impression Cap's known longer than one day. Could there be more than one spy on IronMan's team?
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> Hulkling's impersonation of Pym must be independent of the Tigra information. There are any number of ways that Tigra could have been found out.

True. Here's hoping its revealed and enjoyably relevant!
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> > I am still holding out hope it might be Mr. Fantastic. I've never seen Reed's personality resemble the emotional yoyo it has become. One panel he is cold, dispassionate, almost soulless (Clor surgery). A panel later he cares about little kids and Sue and Johnny not facing incarceration and how he had the stones to stand up to the president of the USA.
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> Yet his desire for special privileges for Johnny and Sue just makes him more of a jerk as he continues putting other people's wives and brothers-in-law in prison.

Agreed. Left a bad taste in my mouth, too.
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> > Later near the end of the book, he has the look of soppy milquetoast again as the traitor is revealed and both forces stand ready to oppose one another again. He has the look of the only hero not wanting this inevitable confrontation. Everyone eles' jaws are set and looking very volatile and ready for a fight. Kudos to McNiven's artwork on the subtleties of human expression.
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> McNiven's art is so transcendent that he makes me like this series despite the faulty characterization.

One thing on McNivens art. I keep hearing the artwork is the reason for the delay in the series. Any concrete reasons why? (If this has been covered on the board I have not been lucky enough to catch it). The art was great in the book, but I saw nothing so complicated as to explain why the book has been delayed again. I get the impression they are asking him to redo pages to fit a reworking of the original planned story.
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> > Could there still be another spy in Tony's ranks? Could it be Reed? If not, I still get the impression Reed may switch sides during the final battle.
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> Given the fact that Reed will be fighting Sue and Johnny... I guess a switch is plausible.
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> > And to enforce Dr Shallots theory that Miriam Sharpe might be Mephisto in disguise, I found it interesting that the story switches from the scene with Miriam to Dr Strange sitting in the middle of what might be a pentagram.
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> Even though I personally enjoy your theory as entertainment... I doubt it's accurate.
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> > Holding out hope for the redemption of Mr. Fantastic, and all the heroes.....
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> Meanwhile, one of my favorite heroes was treated with utter contempt. I'm speaking of the Punisher. Are Millar and Ennis feuding or something? Or does Millar simply fail to "get" the Punisher? I mean, for God's sake, two villains show up, and he shoots them by reflex? No calculation, no analysis, just lifts his guns and pulls the triggers? Come on. He doesn't behave like that. He's not a mad dog. He's not insane. Unless we think Galactus is insane. Or Dracula.
I think Millar really fails to "get" any of the long established heroes of the 616 universe. Been the real curse of this series.
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> I stopped buying Punisher: War Journal for the same reason. The writer on that is as clueless as Mark Millar where the Punisher is concerned.
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> Frank Castle is a grim, merciless, methodical executioner - a consummate professional exterminator. War is mathematics for him. Combat is logic. He knows exactly what he's doing and why he's doing it at all times.
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> I agree that he wouldn't fight Cap. He would rather take a beating. That was correct.
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> But forgetting where he is and what he's doing and just automatically unloading both barrels at the sight of bad guys? Never.
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> Bucky
>

ITS PONDERRIN' TIME

> One thing on McNivens art. I keep hearing the artwork is the reason for the delay in the series. Any concrete reasons why? (If this has been covered on the board I have not been lucky enough to catch it). The art was great in the book, but I saw nothing so complicated as to explain why the book has been delayed again. I get the impression they are asking him to redo pages to fit a reworking of the original planned story.


I really think McNiven is taking his art to its ultimate pinnacle in this comic. That apparently means he can't do a full issue in a month. I personally doubt there's anything more to it than that. The answer was to provide more lead time up front but that's water under the bridge at this point.

The TPB will be exquisite, no question. Every single panel is a mini masterpiece. Which is the only saving grace of the series, since the writing is amateurish at best.


> > Meanwhile, one of my favorite heroes was treated with utter contempt. I'm speaking of the Punisher. Are Millar and Ennis feuding or something? Or does Millar simply fail to "get" the Punisher? I mean, for God's sake, two villains show up, and he shoots them by reflex? No calculation, no analysis, just lifts his guns and pulls the triggers? Come on. He doesn't behave like that. He's not a mad dog. He's not insane. Unless we think Galactus is insane. Or Dracula.
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> I think Millar really fails to "get" any of the long established heroes of the 616 universe. Been the real curse of this series.


Agreed. Characterization has been well below fanfic level. And I mean exactly what I said. Well below fanfic level. It doesn't even qualify as talented amateur adult level. The characterization is third grade beginner level. Any adult could do it better. Any high school kid could do it better. Any middle schooler could do it better.

Here's a fun experiment. The part where Cap and the Falcon are explaining the layout of 42. Did you even notice the Falcon had a word baloon in that? You can only tell by looking where the baloon points. The speech patterns of Cap and the Falcon are rendered as utterly identical. Yet it's not a letterer error because the panel is clearly drawn to indicate the Falcon is the speaker. Any high school kid would have realized the speech pattern should shift at least slightly. It's Characterization 101 for God's sake. Except "101" implies college level and I maintain this basic stuff is "grammar school obvious."


Bucky



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