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Post By
Tiger Shark

In Reply To
Paul

Subj: Mr. Kline! Mr. Kline! Mr. Kline! - That's MY Rant! [SPOILERS]
Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 at 10:57:35 am EDT (Viewed 3 times)
Reply Subj: Re: I Know Where You're Coming From, Since We've Discussed This Many Times
Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 at 12:52:31 am EDT

Previous Post

While I'm not particularly interested in the "controversy" about the Rhino, and I'm *really* not interested in contributing to another iteration of the old "comics were more fun when I started reading them than they are now" tale, your list of villains you want to see revived is intruiging. Some of the characters on the list (the Hang Man, Mongoose, Quicksand, Man-Bull, Vermin, the Unicorn) all have decent gimics, cool designs (or at least the potential for good redesigns), and interesting power sets. I would totally be in favor of, say, Spider-Man having to stop the Man-Bull instead on Mr. Hyde from robbing a bank if a given story called for it. And the team of Mongoose and Quicksand could be substituted for the Wrecking Crew in a number of instances. So I'm totally with you there. Also, for all we know, the various Asgardian villains you mention may well come back now that there's a reqular Thor book again, so there's that. On the other hand, not every villian from Marvel's past is exactly ripe for revival, in my oppinion. Mr. Klein, for example, is probably best left to the dustbin of early 70s comics. His origin is too complicated and inconsistent, and even if a writer wanted to clear all that up, why bother for a relatively generic robot assassin/mastermind from another dimension/time/whatever it was (see, overly convoluted origin). I agree with your overall argument, but only insofar as it encourages the reintroduction of needlessly underused but otherwise sound characters in place of overexposed ones.


> Many of us are completely disenchanted with the Rhino, the Green Goblin/Norman Osborn, Mr. Hyde, the Juggernaut, the Wrecking Crew, Venom, Carnage, Sabertooth, Magneto, and others due to constant overuse. I'm one of them.
>
> It's not that I don't like these characters, but when we see them trotted out month in and month out, they lose all their appeal, especially, when has been the case under JQ, they're not used very creatively (see, for example, Austin's and Bendis' use of the Wrecking Crew/Wrecker, and the WC didn't do much that was interesting in the recent Omega Flight either).
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> To some of us, using the same characters endlessly seems both lazy and unimaginative.
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> I'd much rather see a writer take a lesser or little used character like Karnilla, Black Wing, the Brute, Maelstrom, Umar, the Faceless One, Ymir, Centurion, Halflife, the Man-Bull, Mesmero, the Hang Man, Vermin, the Vanisher, the Griffin, Quicksand, the Petrified Man, the Pirahna, the Enchantress, the original Jester, Llyra, Zaladane, the Tatterdamalion, the Unicorn, ZZAAAXXX, the Mongoose, Mr. Kline, Dragonfly, etc. and really do something with them--that is, set them front and center stage in an arc, as they deserve to be.
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> Marvel has a backlog of literally hundreds of such 'evil' characters, some who simply never found a creative advocate as, say, Sabertooth did.
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> A secondary part of this is that all too often, the villains/criminals/antagonists are just trotted out for a few panels with little if any characterization, are treated like objects of humor by obth writer and heroes, and are then thumped back into whatever degree of limbo or oblivion they currently hale from.
>
> Personally, I have little interest in buying a book in which the Man-pae stands around cooking breakfast while wearing a bathrobe over his costume---Marvel has really sacrificed a lot for a few very cheap shots at humor.
>
> But it's easier to come up with a silly, unfunny joke to justify an entire 22-pages than write a full-bodied, full-blooded story like we used to get.

It's not a matter of gimmick for me, but a matter of characterization. That's what I want to see again: criminals with characters, specific characters, like we used to see in the late 60s, 70s, and 80s: the Living Monoliths, the Sphinxes, the Maelstroms, the Llyras.

Also, 'lower tier' criminals like the Unicorn, Quicksand, the Man-Beast, the Death-Stalker, and the Hangman also had their 'reasons for being,' and were specific characters. You wouldn't easily mistake the Vamp for the Viper of the Viper for Llyra, even if just reading the script of an issue. Or the Enchantress for Umar.

These folks were not 'the interchangeable sieves' most villains have recently become.

I think Mr. Kline's entire opus could be revamped and he could be brought back into the MU in a major way. I don't find his backstory complicated and obtuse, but imaginative and dynamic. I, myself, could do a lot with it. I'd much rather see him be behind the Avengers quagmire rather than a bunch of loony Skrulls.

Good knows his saga was heads and tails above Bendis' current/recent NA stuff.

Kline was a 'Mr. Sinister'-type villain before such villains were common. He remained behind the scenes, created heroes and villains and clones, and manipulated everyone.

He still gets my vote, and I'd love to see him come back, especially since Ultron is now a naked, heavy-teated female with a ponderous mind who likes to stand around in the rain and preach.


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