Marvel Universe >> View Post
Post By
USAgentfan

In Reply To
Runaway22

Subj: Re: Who are the new heroes?
Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 at 10:33:53 am EDT (Viewed 1 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Who are the new heroes?
Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 at 08:37:53 am EDT (Viewed 1 times)

Previous Post

> > So we have in this day and age:
> > - A Spider-man who makes deals with the devil to undo his marriage vows;
>
>
> Havent read the story but on face value I would agree that this sounds out of character, although I'm sure that youre not exactly giving us the full objective facts and that there must be some kind of reasonable justification even if it is a badly written one.
>
>
> > - A Reed Richards who makes a defective, murdering clone/cyborg of his old friend Thor;
>
>
> The same Richards whose own genius has always been his fatal flaw and cant consider the prospect that his inventions wont work?
>
> Clor is just another example of Richards ignoring Sue (the conscience of the team) and having the misguided belief that he can solve all the worlds ills from his lab - nothing really new there.
>
>
> > - A morally compromised Iron Man (who's a walking "the ends justify the means" argument, which formerly was the domain of Doctor Doom and Magneto);
>
> What, like the Ironman who decided the ends justified the means when he started the armour war, or when he faked his death, or when he wiped the worlds minds to hide his own identity, that Ironman?
>
> Hardly a big leap from there to the SHRA which is well in character I feel.
>
>
> > - A traitorous and dead Captain America;
>
> 'Traitorous'?
>
> I suppose Cap wasnt a traitor the last time he ignored his countries call to duty or the time before that?
>
> Cap disagreeing with the way his government wants him to work isnt new, nor is a Cap who can only see the black and white of any argument and not the shades of grey.
>
> > - A Hulk who takes over New York City and tortures his friends;
>
> As opposed to simply smashing NYC up as he normally does?
>
> The same 'friends' blasted him into space and one of his new friends deceived him into thinking that it was those same people who were responsible for destroying his new world and wife.
>
> I would say that Hulks behaviour is perfectly understandible under those circumstances.
>
> > - A Cyclops who commands a death squad and issues kill orders;
>
> Because theres no mutants left and he's finally realised that slapping the wrist of the likes of mutant hating organisations like the Friends of Humanity or the purifiers isnt making them see the error of his ways. Perfectly plausable and perfectly realistic.
>
> You make him sound like a Nazi leading the SS into a Jewish ghetto in 1939 - dramatic much?
>
> Move along - nothing to see here but yet another whine about how our heroes are unjustified or out of character when they either have every justification or have been behaving in a similar manner on and off for years.
>
> You have every right not to like it but lets not pretend that all of this is a big shock thats never happened before and we didnt see coming.
>
>
> >
> > ... among many other examples. Most of the Marvel heroes of old are now fractured and lost in today's world. So who are the shining lights? Who remain heroes in today's world?
> >
> > Here's my short list (in no particular order):
> >
> > 1. Nova. In issue after issue, this guy makes personal sacrifices to do the right thing. Richard Rider is the new Peter Parker.
> >
> > 2. Thor. The last of the big three to remain noble and heroic. I'd like to see him leave the seclusion of Asgard and make himself more of a presence in the world though.
> >
> > 3. Multiple Man. The darker Cyclops gets, the more I admire Jamie Maddrox. He's trying to do good in a morally bankrupt world.
> >
> > 4. The Thing. The heart of the FF had the dignity to rise above the Civil War. He alone had the ability to realize it was lose-lose, and stayed out. I still love this guy.
> >
> > 5. The Young Avengers. I keep seeing them hop in the fray, despite the risk of personal consequences. They're junior fanboys who just want to make a difference, and in my mind, they're vastly more heroic than the actual Avengers (either team).
> >
>
> I agree with all the above examples, but its not like the likes of Ironman, Spidey or Richards arent still putting their lives on the line. Theyre still fighting the good fight but just in a way you dont like.

Though I agree with most of your responces (Peter was just trying to save Aunt May and Captian America is just standing up for all the other heroes), I'll have to disagree on Cyclops. I mean he sends teenagers out to kill their former mentors. I can understand Wolverine, X-23, Warpath, and maybe even Wolfabane, but it dosn't seem right to send the Young X-men out to do a job X-Force could do after they were finished with the Purifiers, or at least send someone older and more in tune with killing. Personally, after Messiah CompleX, I think he is acting a little scrully.


>
> Though I agree with most of your responces (Peter was just trying to save Aunt May and Captian America is just standing up for all the other heroes), I'll have to disagree on Cyclops. I mean he sends teenagers out to kill their former mentors. I can understand Wolverine, X-23, Warpath, and maybe even Wolfabane, but it dosn't seem right to send the Young X-men out to do a job X-Force could do after they were finished with the Purifiers, or at least send someone older and more in tune with killing. Personally, after Messiah CompleX, I think he is acting a little scrully.

Dont get me wrong, I also think that the Cyclops in YXM is either a Skrull or one of Donald Pierces cyborgs or something similar.

The Cyclops in X-Force however I think is real and he behaves in a very similar way - which I think is justified under the current circumstances as the alternative is simply waiting for your enemies to make you extinct.

As for sending teenagers out to fight and die and kill - thats been going on forever. The original X-Men were all teenagers and then there were teams like the New Mutants, New X-Men and the original X-Force who were also all teens and all involved in life or death battles.