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Post By
Jase

In Reply To
Nitz the Bloody

Subj: Re: Nostalgia's Limits
Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 at 08:05:28 pm EDT (Viewed 97 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Nostalgia's Limits
Posted: Fri May 08, 2009 at 07:32:49 pm EDT (Viewed 109 times)



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      I have no problem with Doom deciding that he should use his penis from time to time. (though I wonder how that Loki fantasy will play out once the mischief god inevitably resumes his more familiar gender)



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    Doom removes his armor for the first time in years, steps into a cold shower, then alternates between scrubbing himself hard enough to break skin and hysterically sobbing?


Doom knows all there is to know about the crying game.


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      Gotta disagree about Monica. The bottom-line for me is that she was at least treated as a viable superhero during her tenure as an Avenger whereas she was simply just another punchline for NextWave(admittedly, as were all the other characters though).



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    Viable yet unspectacular superheroes are a dime a dozen in the Marvel Universe, so it could have been any number of other lesser heroes; that it was Monica doesn't bother me.



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      It's a shame she never really caught on with most of the other creators. The real problem as far as her development is concerned is that only her creator Roger Stern was ever seriously interested in writing her.



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    Well, there are plenty of cases where a writer's interest in the character they created for a universe isn't contagious; Lifeguard and Slipstream weren't break-out stars of the X-Men either, were they?


No, but we've seen success stories as well that can mainly be attributed to that kind of approach. It was Claremont's love of Wolverine that helped make him the media juggernaut that he is today.

And on another note, Bendis' run on Avengers has Cage and Spider-Woman on the team(and Jessica Jones), and thus back in the public spotlight simply because he likes them.


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      Does that mean she should always be perceived as a ditz though, regardless of that's how she started out? The problem with Jan around this period is similar as to what occurred with Monica - once Stern stopped writing her, Jan quickly reverted to what everyone knew her best as - Pym's sometimes annoying arm ornament.



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    Busiek tried to write her as a competent leader, with similarly unimpressive results; the regressions to a ditz were done because writing her as anything would be a 180-twist ( at least Ultimate Wasp was designed to be competent from the start, if profoundly messed-up in her personal life ).


Outside of the Stern run, who seriously tried to write Jan as anything more than what she was though? Byrne practically all but had them get re-married during his AWC stint. Busiek tried to fit it in because it was previously established history thanks to Stern, but you could tell while reading it he wasn't really feeling it.

90% of the Jan stuff out there portrays her as a ditz. I know and accept this. It would have been nice though if someone else would have tried to at least build on that to make her more, instead of leaving her as an almost prophetically bizarre version of Paris Hilton.

That said, I'm gonna hijack some points of your thread from the AMB and say I totally buy Pym and Jan as a weird, 616-style version of House and Cameron(though I can see elements of Stacy in there as well). As for Pym's Wilson, Bill Foster had he lived, would have fit that role pretty well, better than Stark or Jarvis, since Wilson, despite his attempts to try and 'fix' House is also in many ways an enabler of him as well. Eric O'Grady, Cassie Lang and Tom Foster, as proteges of Pym would be interesting. If you're looking for a pre-existing character as a Cuddy type for Pym though, you might be better served making one up - I can't(at least at this moment) think of a pre-existing character who could conceivably have that kind of dynamic with Pym.

(Yes, I'm a big House fan. \:\- )


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      I don't know, it's tricky for me to comment on this bit of Hawkeye history since even though I don't necessarily agree with it, I think it's a valid viewpoint nonetheless(not indiscriminately killing/letting die the bad guy).



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    From Bobbi's perspective, having her husband lecture her on the wrongs of killing the guy who raped her isn't really the appropriate response for him.


No, it wasn't.


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      As for the Skrulls - hey, it was war. They were hostile foreign invaders. If they gotta die, they gotta die.



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    I wouldn't phrase it like that, since it isn't about the Skrulls being the " Other ", so much as the situation being tense enough that killing their way out was the only credible option for the Avengers.


It doesn't matter to me about them being the "Other". They were invading Earth. If Hydra, the Brotherhood, or the Kree performed that kind of assault on the planet, then in my mind, the heroes shouldn't feel bad about taking life to preserve life.


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      There's...not nearly enough for me to say about Spider-Man at this point.



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    Let's just hope that soon he returns to a place where he's finished puberty ( or started, for that matter ).


BTW, I like the cast page for Ruby.