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Member Since: Sun Dec 21, 2008
Posts: 2,241
In Reply To
Ancient One 

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 7,650
Subj: Re: Look at it this way.
Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2021 at 03:16:08 pm EDT (Viewed 123 times)
Reply Subj: Re: Look at it this way.
Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2021 at 02:28:22 am EDT (Viewed 139 times)

Previous Post

    But I'm not the guy making the decisions, and I can recognize that Marvel can be a lot more fun now without having any continuity to have to maintain,

I have to disagree.

When I started reading comics the contemporary DC Universe was about 12 years old, and the Marvel Universe about 10. In particular (Because they were my two favourite series) the Legion was 10 years old, and the Avengers roughly 5.

I loved what I was reading in the books I was buying off the stands, and I wanted to know more. Had the Hulk really been an Avenger? What planet was Timber Wolf from? When did Black Panther join the team? Wait! Lightning Lad died? How? And how did he come back? A big part of the enjoyment of these comics was exploring the histories of the characters.

With no definitive history, that enjoyment is gone. There's nothing to explore. Nothing WORTH exploring.

It happened to me with the Legion. I followed the team diligently for 20 years. Then Keith Giffen threw the series' continuity out the window. The events of the last 30 years either happened differently, or hadn't happened at all. And I was done. All the time and effort I'd put in learning about the characters and situations was pretty much for nothing. I was being told to start again. No thanks. I stopped buying the book, and haven't bought it since.

Why should I invest myself in reading stories in an episodic medium if two years down the line I'm going to be told those stories never happened, or don't matter?

The constantly morphing universes of modern Marvel and DC hold no interest for me. It's not that you can't tell good stories in such a framework, it's just that I don't care about them.

Without the bedrock of continuity, they're building their houses on nothing but shifting sand.

Now I have to disagree, lol.

Not about the main points you make, about that I do agree. That's why I said I don't think it was a good idea for Marvel to adopt DC's fluid and constantly changing continuity style.

I do think that most things have a flipside, though. And the flipside here is that Marvel could do something like the Annihilation, Civil War or Sins Past, things that would not have worked in pre Nu-Marvel, and those are fun ideas that I enjoy.

You and I loved hearing about past continuity and finding those stories, and building our knowledge base with each new and fun discovery (I think the first such fun discovery for me when I was just starting reading comics was learning that there had been a team called the Defenders, and that it was the Hulk, Namor, the Surfer, and Dr. Strange).

But new readers will never do that. They can't. They can't tolerate the art or the dialog of older comics. Anything pre-80's is anathema to them. up to late 90's even. They aren't interested.

It's a new readership and it's multimedia and everything is online and easy to find. And if you don't want to read the stuff, you can just read about all of it on Wikipedia. The zoomers aren't going to spend 45 minutes going through dollar boxes. They aren't going to suffer through an Al Milgrom job or a Don Perlin job out of love for the story.

But onto where we disagree: Keith Giffen on Legion.

To me, Keith Giffen revelled in Legion history, he brought it all to life and had fun with it.

To me, it wasn't Giffen that threw out their continuity. That was DC's powers that be, and they did most of it when they acceded to Byrne's wishes and erased Superboy from Legion history, and then came up with that "pocket universe" thing that no one could ever like. Keith, after COIE, was just rolling with the punches as best as he could, and he still had a lot of fun with it and made it fun for me.

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