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Post By
Norvell

Member Since: Sun Jan 02, 2011
Posts: 3,786
In Reply To
Late Great Donald Blake
Moderator

Member Since: Sat May 17, 2008
Posts: 7,353
Subj: Re: I am the Judge, Jury, and Blakesecutioner!!
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 at 12:50:02 am EST (Viewed 83 times)
Reply Subj: I am the Judge, Jury, and Blakesecutioner!!
Posted: Tue Dec 28, 2021 at 08:12:42 pm EST (Viewed 87 times)



    Quote:
    LGDB:  Well the literally nothing that I'm basicing it on is the trope that old people are suspicious or resentful of new things.  That's certainly not totalizing, but it's also not "literally nothing."

That's more ageism than anything, and as I've said, I'm not that old. I'm kind of the target range of age for a comic that costs ~$4-6 USD a pop. Kids ain't investing in this stuff.


    Quote:
    LGDB:  Okay great, so it's a statement of fact, as in not opinion.

Statement of fact that there is a correlation between the so-called bitterness and negativity of the board and the PERCEIVED drop in quality. Clearly they occurred around the same time. Your argument is that it's a coincidence, and that it must be that old people don't 'get it'.


    Quote:
    But as it's apparently meant as a statement of fact I'd say it's pretty controversial on and apparently highly disputed.

No, it's a fact that the negativity on the board increased over the past several years.


    Quote:
    In other words despite, just because something is obviously a matter of your opinion, doesn't mean that the claim you're making (in your opinion) can't be subject to criticism or be capable of being wrong.

Of course not. Why on Earth did you think I would claim otherwise? Again, this is how language works, with statements being made without disclaimers and asterisks that they only represent the person voicing them. This is language 101.


    Quote:
    It's usually through subtle and small distinctions that people try to wriggle out.

Oh, and what am I trying to wriggle out of?


    Quote:
    LGDB:  Yeah I'm not trying to convince you of anything either.  We're having a public conversation.  I'm not in your DMs as it were.  We're both making a case on a public forum.

If I were trying to make a case, I'd make it. I'm stating my opinion, which is backed up by other posts I've made. Should I start a Wikipedia page so you can follow me through my criticisms?


    Quote:
    LGDB:  These are at least gestures towards of evidence.

Which I'm not trying to provide.


    Quote:
    Is there any of these that you think is the strongest case you'd have to make.

No, because anything I say is subjective, and what smells like garbage to me might be the best thing you ever tasted. I can say that I think splash-ages emphasizing 'Iron All-Father!' or the 'Iron God!' or the 'Ego the Necroworld!' (as if readers are going "wowowow!") are absolutely nauseating or painful to read, but you might think its all brilliant.


    Quote:
    The difference between gimmicks and well-worn literary tropes or devices might be objectively the same, i.e. if it's an example you don't like you call it a gimmick, if it's an example you do like you call it a literary device.  And the same with over reliance.  Who decides the appropriate use of these and whether or not they're being "relied upon" as opposed to utilized?

See? You can spin anything Aaron or Cates does as being a valid and well-crafted use of storytelling. Which is why I'm not going down that rabbit hole, having already admitted (repeatedly) that its my opinion both Aaron and Cates' stories are plagued with fluff gimmicks, hollow plots and utter abysmal conclusions.

I can look at Simonson or even Busiek (!!) or Fraction or Gillen and see that Aaron and Cates are not in their league at crafting stories. If Simonson is a 10, and Fraction is a 6, Aaron and Cates are hovering around 1 or 2.


    Quote:
    LGDB:  I also liked that one lol  I think we have different criteria for what makes a thing good.  I'm curious why they're so different.  Like why your criteria are so compelling to you.

I have better taste than you, a firmer grasp of a the source material, and I expect more out of the franchise? Just a hunch.


    Quote:
    LGDB:  Okay now this part to me is gosh darn fascinating.  So what was the point at which his stuff was the kind of quality you thought was worth defending transformed into garbage?

I didn't say I necessarily liked it, I just pushed back against a lot of the criticism against Aaron and promoted the notion that he should be given the space to tell his own version of Thor and Asgard.


    Quote:
    You at one point like his stuff.

No, being a fair person, I was very OPEN to liking his stuff.


    Quote:
    LGDB:   Oh pray tell what am I acting entitled to?   If it's considered entitled to expect someone to justify their claims (especially their strong and strident claims) then I don't think it's an inappropriate or unjustifiable form of entitlement.

You act as though I'm required to write essays detailing and cataloguing my issues with Cates, under a strict literary definition, package my findings and then present them to a judge and jury (you) who will then determine whether or not the predicate for my statement is worthy of consideration. At which point, I guess, I'll be allowed to be on my merry way.

Thanks, I'll pass.


    Quote:
    As far as Blake being punished in the way he's being punished, it's certainly in keeping with the kinds of punishment the Aesir would dole out in the mythology.

I'm sure Cates is like, "Yeah! See, I had this great story ending planned, but I had to ditch it because Blake is now the God of Lies and mythology demands that he must be cosmically tortured; the very thing that created his evil in the first place. Hah, my hands were tied, don't blame me!"

Way to pass the buck. Cates wrote the story, and this is how he ended it. Don't blame the myths for his hackery.

The rest of your post is more of the same. Sorry, I snipped it.



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